Форум Торонто - Torontovka.com
[Search] [Rules] [Register] [Login]
Forums » Archive » Conservative Review  
Page: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 [All]
Author Message
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2003 3:14:00 PM
 
Here I will write my column on politics on fed and provincial levels.
Since the last remaining nationwide conservative bastion of the National Post is slowly sinking, since Sir Conrad Black left this leftwing socialist godforsaken country last century, there will be a lot of challenges for the conservative philosophy in this country and I will try to sound my own account on this.


Edited by - Thor on 9/17/2003 3:15:44 PM
Joined: 9/17/2003
Posts: 1
Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2003 3:24:00 PM
 
Атличная маза. Кагда первый выпускь?
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2003 3:36:00 PM
 
скоро =)
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2003 3:37:00 PM
 
I can't wait... Down with Liberals.

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2003 3:42:00 PM
 
Unfortunately the Liberals are going to win the provincial elections.
It's the way the veteran PCs will punish Eves for screwing up the Harris's Common Sense Revolution and paving way for the Liberals and incompetent McGuinty.
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2003 3:44:00 PM
 
Обещаю воздерживаться и не подвергать твои "консервативные идеи" уничижительной критике:-)

Кстати, сколько даешь еще времени National Post? От них журналисты бегут как крысы... Вот недавно Кристи Блэтчфорд вернулась в Globe and Mail...
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2003 3:47:00 PM
 
Of course, Eves was fully responsible for deregulating the electricity market, cutting down spending on education, health care, public health (including water treatment facilities in Walkerton), public transit, etc.:-) Harris was just in charge, but Eves is responsible:-)
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2003 3:49:00 PM
 
ben,
That's diabolical -- of course! Deprive the private sphere of any money, keep it all in the governments' hands, controlled by those who think more government is the answer! Any better than dreaded Soviet Union propaganda or Nazi propaganda ? I don't think so.
Joined: 3/6/2003
Posts: 64
Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2003 3:51:00 PM
 
Грусто с Постом... Раньше это была моя любимая газета, а теперь когда её звездой стала Rebecca Eckler газета стала неинтересной. Особенно обидно что Mark Steyn перестал писать, у него были великолепные колумны.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2003 3:53:00 PM
 
Thor.. like we discussed, I liked Harris.. but I don't know about Eves. On another hand I refuse to vote Liberal.. Refrain from voting? or still support Eves? Is he competent enough?

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2003 3:59:00 PM
 
Coon,
I don't know. Eves screwed up big time. McGuinty will get elected, it's a natural, he'll be a Bob Ray that got elected due to lack of decent candidates around at the time.
McGuinty will also be a fallback guy when things go wrong, when the teachers start striking and all. He ll be taken down. He's incompetent. Just got big heavies as friends in Ottawa.
Joined: 3/6/2003
Posts: 64
Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2003 4:08:00 PM
 
Maybe the Liberals won't win yet. Accoding to the latest poll the size of their lead is shrinking and is now down to 5%. Considering the margin of error, their victory isn't set in stone.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2003 4:12:00 PM
 
OK.. Can you explain a little more in detail about Bob Ray? And how exactly did Eves fail? I didn't really follow him since he replaced Harris. One thing I like about Eves is he is dishing out a lot of money for events like the SARS concert, the blues fest in Toronto and in Windsor and he is supporting the tourism in Ontario. That is good for me considering the projects im working on right now. But unfortunatly I haven't really paid attention to his policy and his views or his style of governing.

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2003 4:14:00 PM
 
Eve.. one thing I know is that Eves' declaration of lowering the insurance rates and actually putting a cap in place can win him some popularity, because there are too many angry drivers out there who are paying thru the nose. This tactic won Mr Cretin the election when he lowered the price on cigarettes.

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 3/6/2003
Posts: 64
Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2003 4:21:00 PM
 
Also, you can think of a different scenario. If (in the most likely scenario) McGuinty wins, Eves would be ousted as party leader, with Flaherty the likely successor. Flaherty (who was stupidly spurned by his party two years ago is Ontario's most prominent privatizer, free marketer and tax cutter. McGuinty once in power will soon find his platform impossible to implement successfully-the environment and the economy are likely to suffer, making McGuinty vulnerable to opposition pressure. If the opposition comes from the Flaherty Tories, the Ontario Liberals will lurch toward free market solutions, much as the federal Reform Party forced the Liberals to move rightward in the 1990s. And that will give Ontario's free-market Tories policies they want under McGuinty that they could never have had under Eves.

Joined: 3/6/2003
Posts: 64
Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2003 4:25:00 PM
 
Racoon, both Liberals and Tories are promising to cap premiums.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2003 4:34:00 PM
 
Eve.. like I said, I didn't really follow politics for a while, so I'm not sure of what are they promising now. I liked the fact that Eves wants to forbid the teachers and essential services to strike.
Joined: 3/6/2003
Posts: 64
Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2003 4:38:00 PM
 
Yeah. I like this one too.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2003 4:44:00 PM
 
When are we going to get someone young with balls to make the changes and instead of ammending old laws and creating new loopholes for creeps to operate maybe come up with new ones that will make sense. In some ways I admire Putin for this.

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2003 4:48:00 PM
 
Racoon,

it is actually funny, but I think probably natural for most common folks like yourself to choose politically what is likely to work well for their pockets:-)

If I thought this way, I would certainly support morons like Flaherty and other fascists from the provincial PC - what is good for Bay Street, good for Ontario:-( I will only get richer...

by the way, it is Bob Rae, not Ray... He is a former Premier (NDP) and a partner at Goodmans now...

Thor,

yeah, let's have competition in water treatment, electricity distribution, sewage... Let's make sure that millions of people do not have health insurance (like in most American states in the conservative South)
Joined: 9/17/2003
Posts: 1
Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2003 4:48:00 PM
 
Ракун - на следущих выбарах галасуй за миня.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2003 4:56:00 PM
 
Ben - if I want socialism I will move to China. Bottom line is everyone chooses what speaks to them. The Cretin that is running our country is a goof and an embarasment to this nation. When Bay street prospers, like a chain reaction all the businesses prosper, give more jobs and a better return. We have been suffering the resession for what.. 3 years now? I work in the banking system I felt effect of that and still do.

Granted you shouldn't Privatize everything but it gets to a point where healthy competition will not do any harm. I don't know when was the last time you had to deal with the Gov't officials and these are the most pathetic assholes that exsist on this planet aside of the cab drivers. One thing I think should be outsourced to a 3rd party that is the Garbage collectors. I think that a private body will be able to do it faster, better and with higher efficiency.

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 9/10/2002
Posts: 7576
Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2003 4:57:00 PM
 
I personally like this from PC's platform:

"A Break For Homeowners

Owning their own home remains the ’Canadian dream’ for most
Ontarians, and a home mortgage is the largest debt most people
will ever have. Our historic mortgage interest tax deduction will help
more Ontarians realize their dreams and better handle their
mortgage expenses.

The deduction will be limited to the first $5,000 of mortgage
interest paid, so that this tax break will have its greatest impact
on moderate-income families. We will phase in the deduction over
five years. Once fully implemented, homeowners will be able
to deduct up to $5,000 in mortgage interest payments from their
incomes, resulting in provincial income tax savings of
up to $500 per year."
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2003 5:14:00 PM
 
PatMunits: good point..

one more point is that theres always going to be free health care in Canada and only because that Canadians are taking too much pride in it over the USA.


--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2003 6:04:00 PM
 
ER,

interesting, if you work in the banking sector you must know that, unlike the US, Canada has not had a recession (may be a few months, but not more).

Second, I deal with government officials at a fairly high level and with Bay street as well on a daily basis. Same number of smart people. Same number of assholes.

Third, mortgage deductibility is a complete nonsense at this point. It will be like a 100 bucks for homeowners, but a huge hole in the budget. If there is a deficit, and the province is running a growing hidden deficit, then we will have to pay for it eventually. Conservative economists will agree on that.

Besides, I want to pay 1200 a year to the government (instead of getting pathetic 100 a month) to ensure the quality of water, steady supply of electricity, and smoothly running public transit. I do not need this pathetic money - make the services I need work!

Joined: 9/5/2003
Posts: 102
Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2003 7:44:00 PM
 
Ну все, блин, кто в банке работает или близко к адвокатуре - такие умники!
В Канаде рецессии не было?
А какого хрена ставки недавно были снижены?
А опасения дефляции в прессе?
А что творится с занятостью, или 8% безработицы - это не рецессия?
Я НЕ хочу платить 1200 в год и хочу иметь нормальный сервис.
И не хочу внимать человеку, который говорит о любви к котятам и собакам вне контекста.
Хватит совка!
Joined: 5/19/2002
Posts: 151
Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2003 8:06:00 PM
 
Обращение к Тору и Принцу Тишины

Так как вы двое тут самые разбирающиеся в этом деле, помогите. Получил карточки, 2 Октября тянут выбирать. Обычно я не голосую, так как на избирательных билетах нету пунктика "Послать всех в задницу", они все одного навоза дети. Но тут недавно товарищь известил меня что если я не голосую, то мой билет, как бы получает та партия которая сейчас в силе. Так не честно, поэтому в этом году решил проголосовать. Проблема заключается в том что я не знаю за кого. Их предвыборную гонку где они друг другу грязью поливают, агитируют народ и обещают золотые горы я не смотрю.

Так что если можно, по русски, и так чтобы попонятливей тут, в танке было, обьясните, кто на горизонте вообще есть, какие партии, что они обещают ( вкратце, так как они все обещают много чего ) и что на ваш взгляд самое лучшее из всей этой фигни. Мои позиции таковы, я за то чтобы землю- крестьянам, бензин втрое уменшился, больше денег вкладывали в системы ambulance, police and fire departement, меньше воняли и больше делали. Всё.

Заранее спасибо.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 1:58:00 AM
 
ben.. когда ты думаешь будет такое что за $1200 в год тебе всё на тарелочке с золотой каёмочкой принесут.. даже спасибо не скажут.. про говермент офишиалс я говорю в большей степени на низких позициях, как например эти ублюдки, которые сидят в МинЗдраве где ОХИП получаешь .. такие гандоны, одни пакистанцы и черножепые, ленивые, по английски мало кто говорит.. никто ничего не знает, а бастовать любят.

Лообще что такое Юнион? Подонки Комунисты.

бен - я не буду насчет рессешона говорить потому что т-о беар уже сказал и причем правильно.. закрывают все глаза на факт того, что Харис предоставил кондиции и урезку в налогах малых бизнесов и дал хорошие льготы Американским компаниям, которые пооткрывали сдесь своих лавочек и заводиков..

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 2:05:00 AM
 
насчет учителей скажу так: 85% безмозглые бараны .. сдесь в 11ом классе учат квадратные уровнения и в 12ом тригонометрию.. я в Израеле учил тригонометрию в 8ом классе

учителя сдесь не обязанны иметь Бачелорз.. и работают по 4-4.5 часов в день и им оплачивают летние каникулы... Во всех нормальных странах учителя работают больше часов и им не оплачивают лето.. вот так.. суки зажрались.. правильно Харис на них охотился, но юнионы не дали
Joined: 6/27/2003
Posts: 657
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 8:02:00 AM
 
I am voting green party! They are transferring taxes from people to businesses, because the latter are heavy resouce users. I am starting to wonder why they call themselves green? My guess says that they drunk too much vodka and as the result no longer can think straight.

I am not against preserving environment. I am for it with both hands, but such silly platform will never get attention of any reasonable person. Do businesses consume the resources for themselves? They do create products that we all consume.
Are they suggesting to drive businesses out of province and
then they have nobody to tax?

Speaking of Tories they proved that they are not much further away. Private ownership will not improve efficiency and costs in huge, expensive and heavily regulated operations like hydro.
There is never going to be enough competition in this industry
as cost of entry is too high and point of any business is
generating profits for owners not public interest. Serving public interest comes only into play when it helps generating the profits. Okay, okay... they wanted to cut the cost to give everybody a
tax credit people can use to pay for higher cost of hydro. They
did not appreciate the fact that people want lower tax TOGETHER with their low price for hydro. They selected Eves as a leader. He might be a great guy in the world, but he does not impress me much when I see him on TV. He looks like a fox and lacks
charisma. These guys cannot think straight. Boot them out. They drunk too much scotch.

Who is left? Of couse pot smoking and gay LIberals. So what?
We had this stuff going on for a while and everybody accepted
this as part of our social order. They have not been involved into this provincial mess. They done reasonably well on federal level and
refusing to help province is throublesome times, clearly hinted boot PCs out and then we can all smoke pot and be happy.

à dieu






Edited by - jazz on 9/18/2003 8:08:37 AM
Joined: 2/20/2003
Posts: 11112
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 8:15:00 AM
 
Поскольку ни один из кандидатов не вызывает у меня особого щенячьего восторга, буду выбирать из трёх зол меньшее.
Или доверюсь Его Величеству Случаю и буду подкидывать монету:
Если упадёт на орла или решку - голосую за PC.
Если на ребро - Liberal.
А если зависнет в воздухе - ...то тогда NDP.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 8:23:00 AM
 
В моих глазах лучше Ивз чем любой Либерал.. достаточно их на федеральном уровне, но я хочу сказать что всё таки за последний год Ивз не плохо справился с САРСом, Блекаутом и тд..

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 10/10/2001
Posts: 9593
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 9:06:00 AM
 
согласем с Шалуном, все три - полнейшие распиздяи. в отличии от него, однако, голосовать вообще не буду. это просто цирк. вспомните Хариса. чувак сейчас член директории общества Магна. Никто не удивлен почему Магна стала одной из самых богатых компаний Канады. просто напросто гарантируют себе пенсионные. Ивс - не исключение. Вся эта херня с автомобильными страховками и хайдро - не просто так. Кто-то сделал на этом деньги и по истечении срока Орни (если он не будет переизбран) этот самый кто-то будет ему очень благодарен. Хотя оно всегда так и было, некоторые хоть что-то волокут в этом деле и что-то делают meanwhile, а Магенти вообще как с луны свалился. мне кажется ему все время на ухо шепчут че вообще говорить надо. Короче следите за спонсорами этих клоунов, и в зависимости кто выйграет, преобретайте сток тех компаний.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 9:09:00 AM
 
Horny Eves
Joined: 9/10/2002
Posts: 7576
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 9:10:00 AM
 
I don't like paying interest on money that I have never spend. I don't want my children to pay interest on money that I would be forced to spend under a fiscally-irresponsible goverment.

From PC's platform:
"We will reduce the provincial debt by a further $5 billion over the next five years. We’ve already paid down the overall debt by $5 billion since the last election (twice as much as we had promised), saving Ontario taxpayers $791 million a year in interest payments."

$791M is a lot of roubles that can be spend on social programs.

Currently Ontario pays 8 Billion 550 Million Dollars each year in interest on loans accrued by previous provincial goverments. We also spend every year additional 550 Million Dollars to pay interest for Ontario Hydro debt. Combined, this means that each person who lives in Ontario, including newborn babies, spends $750 annually just to pay Credit Card interest acquired years ago.

PHUCK THAT! I don't want to pay someone else's credit card bills.

Edited by - PatMunits on 9/18/2003 9:18:56 AM
Joined: 3/25/2002
Posts: 2486
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 9:15:00 AM
 
Actually, I went to my own PC party meeting in the Beaches area. Well, the mood was quite upbeat. Remember that two times in a row, PC came from behind to beat the Liberals. So it's not over until it's over. I wish Mike could run again, but oh well...
Joined: 9/10/2002
Posts: 7576
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 9:18:00 AM
 
Yeah baby, I like this:

"$75 million to construct high-occupancyvehicle
lanes on portions of Highway 404
and Highway 403 and bus-bypass shoulders
on Highway 403;" (from PC's platform)

"$50 million for York Region’s Quick Start
program to develop rapid transit in four
heavily travelled corridors;"

"Start work immediately on the $200
million first phase of a bus rapid transit
system across the Greater Toronto Area;"
Joined: 9/10/2002
Posts: 7576
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 9:29:00 AM
 
хотите больше денег на здравохранение, тогда попросите у Либералов в Оттаве:

Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 9:31:00 AM
 
For some reason i didnt get the voting notice as of yet. Did everyone else get it already?



--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 12/21/2001
Posts: 30002
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 9:31:00 AM
 

На тему за кого глосовать, мне вспомнился старый анекдот, как к раввину перед свадьбой пришла невеста советоваться какую комбинашку лучше надеть, розовую или голубую, после долгих разборок обалдебший раввин говорит, девушка, хоть розовую, хоть голубую, вас так и так выебут;) (сорри, из песни слов не выкинешь)
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 9:36:00 AM
 
Пат: васап: где можно достать брейкдаун за что платит муниц., пров. и федеральный говермент. Я вообще не помню когда федералы последний раз потратили копейку в Онтарио, кроме "помощи" после САРСа.

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment

Edited by - Evil Raccoon on 9/18/2003 9:37:11 AM
Joined: 6/28/2003
Posts: 1523
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 9:39:00 AM
 
для многих обывателей обсуждение вопросов политики, участие в выборах и вся это мутотень- что-то вроде игры самолюбия, в первую очередь помогающей им почувствовать свою мнимую значимость.





--
-Wanderer-
Joined: 9/10/2002
Posts: 7576
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 9:44:00 AM
 
Romka, честно говоря я не знаю где можно найти кто за что платит. Те цифры которые использовал, я взял на Stats Canada, МинФин Онтарио, и PC's party websites.
Joined: 10/10/2001
Posts: 9593
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 9:50:00 AM
 
Pat:

$75 million to construct high-occupancyvehicle
lanes on portions of Highway 404
and Highway 403 and bus-bypass shoulders
on Highway 403;" (from PC's platform)


most likely won't fly. they will be constructing a new ramp from 404 north to 401 west (core). the idea is to have an HOV lane from 16th Avenue to 401. the new N-W ramp will also become an HOV ramp. no HOV lanes are even thought of for Highway 401 at this point. DVP most likely won't have them either, although they're trying to figure something out (City of Toronto). having an HOV lane on 404 between 16th and 401 is a dumb idea if you ask me, unless it becomes a part of a larger HOV network in the future, which I don't foresee. hwy 403 may work though.

"$50 million for York Region’s Quick Start
program to develop rapid transit in four
heavily travelled corridors;"


good idea, and both the Region and the province are really getting into it. Highway 7 corridor is going to become one of the rapid transit corridors in the region.

"Start work immediately on the $200
million first phase of a bus rapid transit
system across the Greater Toronto Area;


watch for a new system along Yonge Street in the near future. They are currently proposing separating transit traffic from the rest of traffic by providing transit lanes...in the middle of the road.
Joined: 9/10/2002
Posts: 7576
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 9:55:00 AM
 
- W -, может быть, но я своими глазами по телеку видел как в одной не очень далёкой от нас стране, выбрали одного мудака своим правителем. Причём всё решило каких пару сотен голосов в одном небольшом округе.

С тех пор выборы мне стали небезразличны. Я не люблю когда мне говорят что я сам выбрал такое правительство если я его не выбирал.

Кстати, если помните, в Америке за Гора по всей стране проголосовали 543895 человек больше чем за Буша.
Joined: 12/21/2001
Posts: 30002
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 10:06:00 AM
 
Патрик, а к власти все равно пришел Буш....
Joined: 10/10/2001
Posts: 9593
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 10:07:00 AM
 
так что все ровно будет как сказал старый раввин
Joined: 12/21/2001
Posts: 30002
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 10:09:00 AM
 
Прааально, питачок, прааально;)
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 10:11:00 AM
 
mrs.. it nice to have a choice of who will fuck you

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 9/10/2002
Posts: 7576
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 10:11:00 AM
 
pitachok,

most likely won't fly. they will be constructing a new ramp from 404 north to 401 west (core). the idea is to have an HOV lane from 16th Avenue to 401. the new N-W ramp will also become an HOV ramp. no HOV lanes are even thought of for Highway 401 at this point. DVP most likely won't have them either, although they're trying to figure something out (City of Toronto). having an HOV lane on 404 between 16th and 401 is a dumb idea if you ask me, unless it becomes a part of a larger HOV network in the future, which I don't foresee. hwy 403 may work though.

OK, I'm a bit selfish here. I commute every morning on 404 from Aurora to Sheppard, and occasionally all the way to Gardiner. I have seen HOV lanes in action in Minneapolis, I say that they really do work.

404 is a freaking parking lot now. In the summer it was nice, but starting September 8 it became just plain awful. 404 will be extended to Simcoe and further East. York Region is growing by leaps and bounds. There's an immediate need for a solution.

I think I just read last weekend in the Star that York Region has already commited $150M for expanded transit system. Provincial goverment plans to add another $50M. I like it.

There's a ton of construction would have to be done on Yonge street in downtown Aurora and downtown Richmond Hill if they want to add transit lanes. Yonge street is just not wide enough in those places to support two more lanes.
Joined: 12/21/2001
Posts: 30002
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 10:22:00 AM
 
Ракун, ха-ха-ха!
Joined: 6/27/2003
Posts: 657
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 10:30:00 AM
 
People, HOV lanes are not really an issue in this election. No matter which government we have they will have to do something about it.

It is all about higher level approaches to the issues. It looks like all partyies are promising something without any clue about effects of their actions and costs.

Pat you have to pay for all debts. The debts were incured to pay for the infrastructure you use now. It is like with mortages. If you want house and do not have enough cash to buy it outright, you take a mortage and pay it off later. If you do not want to have a mortage you cannot have a house.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 10:30:00 AM
 
What I would like to see is Public Transit improved overall. Pat, you know that in NYC people do not need a car same as in Moscow. while you are in the core it is easier to take the subway. The security issues is a different story, but Guilianni has done a fantastic job over there cleaning out that armpit.

The Sheppard addition has been a significan jolt to nearby businesses especially the 2 malls on the way and naturally the real estate went up 10-15% just because of the accessebility.

The concern of York region is that nowadays because it becomes more and more expencive to live in Toronto, people are moving outside the city limits, but not all have cars. So your choice is either Go train or York Public Transit which remind me of Mad Maxx movie.

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 6/27/2003
Posts: 657
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 10:32:00 AM
 
We need subway line extended to Square One in Mississauga
Joined: 10/10/2001
Posts: 9593
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 10:37:00 AM
 
Pat,

it is not going to get any better, that's for sure. the need for additional capacity is at 401/dvp. DVP cannot be widened any further. there you have it: 2 lanes from 404, 2 lanes from 401 into 3 lanes on the DVP..something gotta give....BTW, 404 through Sheppard (SB) will be similar to what they have right now for the northbound direction - a short core-collector system from north of Sheppard to Highway 401. But these are just peanuts.

Yonge Street in...North York

'Coon, без разницы кто, главное быть готовым чтобы хоть как-то уменьшить боль.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 10:38:00 AM
 
jazz - that would be a good start.. when I worked downtown Bloor and Bay It took me 15 minutes to get on a train because of all the people there, then coming to my beloved North York in a shrimp can with all kind of diverse people crammed inside this metal shitbox that is driving you 50 m/h into the dark oblivion ..

that is why my interpertation of TTC is Take The Car.. riding the rocket leaves you with nothing but bad experience each time you need to use it. I wish I could use it more, but frankly, I try to avoid it.

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment

Edited by - Evil Raccoon on 9/18/2003 10:40:40 AM
Joined: 10/10/2001
Posts: 9593
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 10:40:00 AM
 
Raccoon, good points about public transit. it sucks a big one. by the sound of it, they're trying to do something about it. we'll see.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 11:10:00 AM
 
pitachok: Это же им самим выгодно.. бабки то они гребут себе..

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 9/10/2002
Posts: 7576
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 11:10:00 AM
 
I'm not talking about increasing DVP capacity, that's too costly.

There are actually 2 lanes coming from 401 Westbound (1 express, 1 collector), 2 lanes from 401 Eastbound (1 express, 1 collector), and 3 lanes from 404. That's 7 lanes that eventually have to merge into 3 DVP lanes.

However, we do need an expanded pipeline from York Region to GTA Transit System. To take a subway, you first have to get to that Subway. The only cost-effective and efficient way to get to Yonge or Sheppard subway lines from North Richmond Hill, Oak Ridges, Aurora, Newmarket and other small places is to drive your own car down 404, Leslie, Bayview or Woodbine to Faiview or to Finch Station.

When I was a student I was always amazed taking every morning a virtually empty GTA Buses from Finch Station. They don't need so many buses on some of the routes, they're not being used. And they still want more money? Screw them, build more subway lines instead. I used to live in NYC, I'm familiar with their public transportation. It works, and works well. But they also have a huge subway system http://de.geocities.com/metroplanet_nyc/nyc-map.htm

What do Liberals propose? They want to create another goverment institution to oversee GTA transportation system:

"We will bring a region-wide approach to identifying and meeting GTA transit needs by creating the Greater Toronto Transportation Authority (GTTA).

The new GTTA will be given the clout and resources to tackle gridlock and ensure free movement of people and goods in a rapidly growing region.

The GTTA will be given the mandate to repair the damage from years of neglect by the Harris-Eves government: more GO trains on existing lines, expanded GO parking, new vehicles for the TTC and the removal of highway bottlenecks.

An immediate priority for the GTTA will be to establish within 18 months a seamless, integrated ticket system that will allow users to move easily across the region using a single ticket."


Yeah, sounds similar to PC's, but I like a bit more concrete plan of action (at least PC say what they have already planned). Not something along the lines: "Well, will make another office. Those dudes will spend 3 months buying office equipment, 6 months teaching staff, 5 months learning from other municipalities, 18 months fighting with unions for new contracts, and then they will decide what's better for GTA and suburbs."
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 12:02:00 PM
 
I will respond after I get home.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 12:23:00 PM
 
Right.. create A new entity that will be fully controlled by Liberals and just hire more paperpushers.. waste of money. Like I said, this sector should be privatized, but smartly.

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 3/25/2002
Posts: 2486
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 3:07:00 PM
 
A long time ago, a champion of intellectual thought, namely Thomas Jefferson said it right:" The best government is the one that governs the least." Cut and dry, ladies and gentlemen. What else can you add to the aforementioned statement? Yes, nothing. Thank you very much.
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 5:02:00 PM
 
I am sure, Prince of Silence, you would want to live in the United States of the Jeffersonian times - when the government indeed governed a million times less than now. What a wonderful life they had - the US society shown in "Gangs of New York" is very respectable if compared it to the Jeffersonian times and/or other areas of the US where there was even less government. No doubt you would have been much happier in those brutal amd primitive times than in today's over-regulated society:-)
Joined: 7/20/2002
Posts: 8934
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 5:13:00 PM
 
тор, ты мне лучше скажи, партия анашистов будет на октябрьских выборах баллотироваться? а то там одни мудозвоны...

и, кстати, господа дискутёры, вы, ради Бога, не обижайтесь, но ваш диспут иногда напиминает классическое стихотворение генриха гейне...

http://evduluman.narod.ru/Heine_02.htm

Edited by - kotovski on 9/18/2003 5:28:48 PM
Joined: 5/19/2002
Posts: 151
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 5:29:00 PM
 
Так, короче. За кого голосовать?
Joined: 7/20/2002
Posts: 8934
Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2003 5:32:00 PM
 
о, кажись партия зеленых будет выдвигаться. так что, раз уж анашисты не выдвигаются, буду за зеленых голосовать, один хрен.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Saturday, September 20, 2003 8:32:00 AM
 
www.cbc.ca/storyview/MSN/2003/09/19/clarkson030919

why do we need this bitch?

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 5/19/2002
Posts: 151
Posted on Saturday, September 20, 2003 8:35:00 AM
 
Всё ясно, пиздунов тут собралось, не меньше чем в правительстве.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, September 24, 2003 11:07:00 PM
 
Северный, за кого, за кого,
за Прогрессив Консёрвативз ессна...
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, September 24, 2003 11:21:00 PM
 
or Canadian Alliance on a federal level.

Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, September 24, 2003 11:24:00 PM
 
kotovski,
если будешь голосовать за зелёных то просто голос потеряешь.
на самом деле серьёзные игроки на фед. и пров. уровнях исторически Ториз и Либералз. Ну НДП.
Канадский Альянс ещё не разу не выиграл пров. выборов, но Реформ партия, преобразовавшаяся в Альянс уже серьёзный участник и борец за власть на национальном уровне.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, September 24, 2003 11:30:00 PM
 
как раз вся проблема в том, что многие левые, которые не разделяют политику коррумпированных либералов, отдают им свой голос из-за того, что либералы мимикрируют под левых.
жаль. ндп для них слишком радикально, и естественно для левые редко находят резон голосовать за Ториз.

Ториз на самом деле сами деляцца на консёрватив и красных. Рэд Ториз схожи с модерат либералами.

Сейчас происходят интересные движения в лагерях двух правых партий КА и ПК. Может быть наконец-таки найдут консенсус и объединяцца ??? Ведь ГОП в штатах включает в себя разные направления правых, from libertarion to right wing.


Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, September 24, 2003 11:47:00 PM
 
Северный,

Мои позиции таковы, я за то чтобы землю- крестьянам, бензин втрое уменшился, больше денег вкладывали в системы ambulance, police and fire departement

это как раз что Ernie Eves и обещает.

1,000 more police on our streets, drunk drivers off the road(there goes the russian vote =) lol ), highways and transits we need, stop abuse of welfare, ohip and legal aid, strong consumer protection laws.

Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, September 25, 2003 12:50:00 AM
 
Thor, кстати Харис очень класно Велфер придушил.. сделал по модулю Американского Воркфера.. хочешь получать бабки? иди работай, хочешь или не хочешь

плюс мне нравится что Ивз хочет Учителей на место поставить - то что Харис не смог добится..

а Макинти, бля, ай донт траст хим.. и вообще, Долой Либералов, френч бастардз (фед - Кретиен, Мартинз)...
Joined: 7/20/2002
Posts: 8934
Posted on Thursday, September 25, 2003 12:29:00 PM
 
если будешь голосовать за зелёных то просто голос потеряешь.


херн знает, сложная это штука -- голосование. во всяком случае, лучше, чем "против всех". когда в канаде сделают наконец-то proportional representation, то это не будет потерей голоса -- какую-то часть зеленых выберут в сенат, а они там ой как нужны.

кстати, идею о proportional representation поддерживают альянс, ндп, и провинциальные либералы. федеральным-то либералам это нафиг не нужно, потому что мешает вертеть на хрену всю канадскую политику как захочет левая нога кретьена. надеюсь, что proportional representation не за горами, а то блин феодализм какой-то.

да, так вот, может, я и теряю голос, зато идейно теряю. выберут-то все равно либералов.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Thursday, September 25, 2003 12:33:00 PM
 
кстати, идею о proportional representation поддерживают альянс, ндп, и провинциальные либералы.
100%

федеральным-то либералам это нафиг не нужно, потому что мешает вертеть на хрену всю канадскую политику как захочет левая нога кретьена. надеюсь, что proportional representation не за горами, а то блин феодализм какой-то.

стопудово, если проп. репр-шЫн станет реальностью то либералов быстренько попрут из Оттавы.

выберут-то все равно либералов.
вот такое мышление и позволяет либералам избирацца из-за того что их противники не голосуют...



Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Friday, September 26, 2003 11:43:00 AM
 
http://www.canada.com/national/story.asp?id=6F7C11A9-1601-4BFC-BE5B-78BDDAD0A5F1

United right eyes Harris for leader
Alliance, Tories near deal to create new party

Sean Gordon

The Ottawa Citizen


Friday, September 26, 2003

CREDIT: Ted Rhodes, CanWest News Service (Calgary Herald)

Mike Harris last night addressed speculation that he would pursue the leadership of a united right. Speaking in Banff, he said: "I don't think we should be getting ahead of ourselves but I for one would be prepared to make a contribution and then we'll have to see where it goes."

ADVERTISEMENT


Emissaries from the Canadian Alliance and Progressive Conservatives have reached an agreement in principle to found a new party, and it now appears a movement is afoot to install former Ontario premier Mike Harris as leader.

Organizers from the federal and Ontario Conservative parties confirmed that Harris supporters have been quietly laying the groundwork for a run at leading a united right once a deal is reached to dissolve the Alliance and Tories and found a new party.

And that agreement may now be at hand. In Ottawa, Alliance leader Stephen Harper said he expects to receive a compromise proposal from his representatives and the Tory emissaries "before the end of the week."

"My understanding is there is an agreement in principle, it's a matter of our representatives coming to finalizing that effort," he said. "I'll make a decision shortly after I get the final conclusions of the discussions ... to get an agreement both sides eventually have to make their decisions to sign off, and I don't know what the Tory timeline is on that."

Conservative leader Peter MacKay struck a far less strident tone than on Wednesday, when he blasted the Alliance for purportedly leaking details of the negotiations to the press

"I can tell you the emissaries are doing great work ... I'm confident in the emissary process, I'm confident in the people I have representing me at that table, and we're going to take a very strong and serious look at this," he said.

Mr. Harper doesn't anticipate any further talks, and suggested a meeting scheduled for next week between the emissaries -- former federal finance minister Don Mazankowski, ex-Ontario premier Bill Davis, and Conservative MP Loyola Hearn for the Tories, ex-Reform MP Ray Speaker, Senator Gerry St-Germain and MP Scott Reid for the Alliance -- will simply formalize the agreement.

"I don't think the public wants an endless soap opera, there's been some good discussions over the three months, I think most of the issues have been thoroughly addressed," he said.

Mr. Harper said. "It's time for the parties to make their positions known and take their decisions," Mr. Harper said.

If the two parties are able to reach an agreement, it will first be presented to their respective caucuses, then submitted to the general membership.

Mr. Harper said it would then take three or four weeks "to get some details out to them and get some mechanism whereby they can send back their support or opposition".

It's then hoped a new leader could be in place either late this year or early in 2004.

But before any of that happens, Mr. MacKay has to get his caucus on side.

"Are people nervous about it? Are they concerned? By all means, this is their livelihood ... clearly I'm going to need caucus support for this. And so this is a (multi-tier) process that's got to be in place before we're going to be able to proceed," Mr. MacKay said.

While both leaders are preoccupied with stickhandling a deal, the buzz surrounding a Harris candidacy is intensifying.

The former Ontario premier was in Ottawa on Wednesday night, and, after
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Sunday, November 2, 2003 10:26:00 AM
 
McGuinty promises gas tax, but won't say when
Premier Dalton McGuinty says it is a matter of when, not if, Toronto will receive the gas tax revenues he promised to the city to help fund public transit. But he could not say whether they will be included in his government's first budget.

Dana Borcea
National Post

http://www.nationalpost.com/national/story.html?id=BE4F6835-B1F1-44AE-B923-937E3DBAAD2D

Saturday, November 01, 2003

Premier Dalton McGuinty says it is a matter of when, not if, Toronto will receive the gas tax revenues he promised to the city to help fund public transit. But he could not say whether they will be included in his government's first budget.

"We're going to deliver on all of our commitments; that's what we ran on. But we're going to slow down on some of those," Mr. McGuinty said yesterday during an interview on 680 News.

When pressed to respond to whether Toronto mayoral candidates could count on funds from the gas tax, Mr. McGuinty said he could not yet predict the details of his government's budget.

"I'm not going to draft my first budget -- that we're going to put out in March -- today, right now over the telephone," Mr. McGuinty said.

Throughout his election campaign, Mr. McGuinty pledged to allocate 2¢ a litre of the existing provincial gas tax to public transit.

But on Wednesday, the Premier announced his government had inherited a $5.6-billion deficit from the previous Tory government. He said as a result, he would be forced to postpone or renege on some of his election promises, resulting in a decision to end Hydro price caps despite a pledge to maintain a price freeze on electricity rates.

During yesterday's radio interview, Mr. McGuinty did promise to campaign on behalf of Toronto for federal funds.

"I'll be working as hard as I can to get the federal government to recognize that municipalities, cities and Toronto in particular is where it's at and we've got to work together to strengthen things like public transit here."

He added he had instructed Greg Sorbara, the new Minister of Finance, on the need to balance the budget while delivering on the government's commitments when drafting the Liberal's first provincial budget.

Mayoral candidate David Miller said yesterday despite the government's inability to commit to a time line on delivering the provincial gas tax, he would not consider implementing highway tolls to help fund Toronto's public transit if elected mayor.

"With the McGuinty government on their transit funding commitment, it's a question of when and how much, not if, and so I'm not considering other options," Mr. Miller said yesterday, insisting road tolls were not part of his election platform.

Mr. Miller said if the allocation of the gas tax is delayed, he will lead "an alliance of mayors" from across the province facing similar transit challenges, to try to convince the province to deliver on its promise."

John Tory, who according to the latest poll is running a close second to Mr. Miller in the mayoral race, agreed the government's delivery of the gas tax was likely only a matter of timing, but said it helped to highlight the vulnerability of Toronto's public transit.

Yesterday, Mr. Tory reiterated his commitment to rein in public spending and said the news made him want to revisit his idea of securing private funds for Toronto's public transit system.

A spokeswoman for Mr. Sorbara said the Minister of Finance could not predict when and how much of the gasoline tax will be delivered to Ontario cities, but said the government will eventually come through on its promises.

"This government will follow through with the commitment made during the campaign to share a portion of the gaso
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Sunday, November 2, 2003 10:27:00 AM
 
Ontario Liberal leader Dalton McGuinty's decision to hike electricity rates to tackle a $5.6-billion deficit will send a chill through homeowners, who could face monthly bills 15% higher than what they currently pay, industry watchers say.

http://www.nationalpost.com/national/story.html?id=FE51B41A-6CE7-45E7-83EC-04BAC17AD5FA

Ontario Liberal leader Dalton McGuinty's decision to hike electricity rates to tackle a $5.6-billion deficit will send a chill through homeowners, who could face monthly bills 15% higher than what they currently pay, industry watchers say.

Still, those experts, pundits and lobby groups say simply putting a higher cap on the cost of hydro will not address significant problems with Ontario's electricity system.

"Ontario is very close to suffering another blackout and one of the first and most important steps in securing the reliability of the electricity system is ensuring consumers pay the real cost," said Tom Adams, executive director of Energy Probe, a pro-conservation think-tank.

On Thursday, Mr. McGuinty said Dwight Duncan, the Minister of Energy, has 30 days to decide on cost-saving measures before recommending a higher, fixed price for electricity to replace the current rate of 4.3¢ per kilowatt hour set last year by the Progressive Conservative government.

The Premier said he wants a price that better reflects the real costs of electricity.

Mr. Adams estimated the average increase in monthly bills at 15% or more when the Liberal debt-cutting plan is announced.

"It's substantial," he said. "We should be looking at significantly higher electricity prices."

About 10% of that estimate is based on fee hikes linked to Ontario's energy infrastructure, including any additional costs stemming from an investigation into the August power failure that left Ontario and a large swath of the northeastern United States in the dark.

The additional fee hikes will come from the other side of the electricity bill, which is based on the amount of power people consume. But Mr. Adams said it is difficult to forecast how big an increase the government might institute because its energy policies included in the recent Oct. 2 election platform are not specific.

"Given the lack of clarity in terms of their policy thinking, it's impossible to guesstimate what it might be," Mr. Adams said, adding there are dozens of formulations the government could use to increase the price. "The one-word answer is 'up.' "

David Burgess, professor of economics at the University of Western Ontario, believes the Liberals will likely work out a formula by which the rate hike will cover the $700-million deficit caused by the current price-cap.

"It will be the same thing [as the current 4.3¢-per-kilowatt-hour rate] but at a higher level, so the deficit will be less," Prof. Burgess said. "I don't have a lot of sympathy for repegging the rate."

He acknowledged, however, that it would be the most politically astute thing for the newly sworn-in government to do.

Moving to a market rate, under which the consumer would pay full price for the power, would raise bills by about 25%, by some estimates. The raw hydro price would be in the neighbourhood of 6¢ per kilowatt hour.

Prof. Burgess said no one having to pay that kind of price is likely to welcome it.

Deborah Doncaster, executive director of the Ontario Sustainable Energy Association, was also pleased at the possibility of a move closer to the market rate. She wants to see an even higher rate so renewable resources such as wind or solar power, which cost more than hydroelectricity or coal energy sources, can compete at comparable cost.

[email protected]

© Copyright 2003 National Post
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Sunday, November 2, 2003 10:28:00 AM
 
Well, well, well
there go a few election promises good old Dalton gave us =)))
no tax hikes I heard ? A change ?

You get what you deserve ppl of Ontario...

Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Sunday, November 2, 2003 4:49:00 PM
 
Thor: поехали в Альберту жить
Joined: 12/26/2002
Posts: 281
Posted on Sunday, November 2, 2003 4:50:00 PM
 
Меня с собой возмёте?
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Sunday, November 2, 2003 4:52:00 PM
 
давай.. заказываю сизон тикетс на Ойлерз
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Monday, November 3, 2003 5:26:00 PM
 
Странно, что Тор и Енот не вспоминают о том, что нам консерваторы законодательно гарантировали жизнь без дефицита. А оказалось больше 5 миллиардом долларов дефицита. Вот такое лицемерие... Конечно, надо повышать налоги на богатых.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Monday, November 3, 2003 6:28:00 PM
 
Coon, hell yeah, I'm considering it. Though too used to tee dot..

ben,
а как же дефицит бюджета в более 100 миллиардов кдн $ после двух премьеров от НДП и Либ ? где лицемерие ?
или о 2 новых налогах, посредством которых Долтон хочет найти денег для пров. казны ? ведь обещал, I will not raise taxes.
Yeah, right. Famous Liberal lie ~ taxes will stay the same.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, November 20, 2003 9:10:00 AM
 
well.. 2 days to tax hike..

Too bad Lastman couldn't fulfill his dream: separating Toronto from Ontario..
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, November 20, 2003 9:13:00 AM
 
It’s the first true sign of what awaits voters from the newly elected Liberal government. And when Dalton McGuinty’s team unveils its first Throne Speech on Thursday, smokers will be unhappy, workers will smile, and parents will be watching.

Among the items expected to be announced: a hiking of tobacco taxes. The government is looking to compensate for a $5.6 billion deficit, and the sin taxes are the easiest target. A carton of cigarettes could go up as much as $15, to $75.

But while smokes go up, so will the minimum wage. It’s believed the government will increase the amount those who make the least will find in their pay envelopes. Ironically, the move was one of the main platforms in the N.D.P. election campaign – and they’re not even an official party any more.

And the Grits are also expected to let parents and teachers know what formula they’ll use to cap class sizes. Premier Dalton McGuinty made it clear education was the main priority in the election, and he vowed to cut the number of students in junior kindergarten to Grade 3 to just 20. But that would mean hiring more teachers – something the government likely can’t afford.

“You're going to hear a different Throne Speech,” promises McGuinty. “It is not one that is the embodiment of flowery rhetoric. It's going to be grounded in our fiscal reality.” Critics contend that’s political speak for another round of promise breaking.



Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Thursday, November 20, 2003 10:45:00 AM
 
Sorry, but you have to pay for your self-destructive pleasures.

by the way, Racoon, didn't you complain about your auto-insurance hikes? believe me, my friend, insurance companies will be charging enormous premiums for what you called "smokers insurance". because the likelihood of lung and throat cancer is extremely high.

anyway, I promise to donate money for your funeral.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, November 20, 2003 10:53:00 AM
 
ben - Dont hold your breath

ben, I think that you have been brainwashed by the Canadian socializm really badly. I hope one day you will wake up and smell the dirty laundry, because this is ruining the country and the province. FYI - more than 80% of cigarette costs already is diverted into Health care system. So In a way we smoke for Health of millions of Ontarians.
Of corse I complained about auto insurance, but because of people like you the government is fucking us up the ass and you are just begging for more, because you always see the upside.
We are taxed up to the wazoo already and Daltonik is going to implement more taxes. I am tired of this.

Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Thursday, November 20, 2003 12:25:00 PM
 
er,

why are you staying here then? move south, to a sunny state of Texas, where everyone is like you (although oral sex is still illegal):-)
Joined: 3/14/2003
Posts: 9593
Posted on Thursday, November 20, 2003 12:28:00 PM
 
Беня - а ты мне американскую гринкарту дай взамен канацкого паспорта плз.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, November 20, 2003 1:21:00 PM
 
ben: like I indicated before, I can make a lot more money living in States, I just don't want to live down there, plus have too much shit that I do here for me to just move.

And this is the problem: our best doctors leave to work in US, because they get paid much more, same in other professions. You can not try to get rid of everyone that is not naively and blindly believes in this Commie Krap.

Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Thursday, November 20, 2003 2:10:00 PM
 
well, if you do not want to move, then we will keep increasing your taxes my friend until you have to go...

There are just too many of us here who like what you call "Commie Krap" and who hate conservative morons:-)

PS: by the way, I can tell you my friend that there is a huge flood back of lawyers who were leaving a few years ago. My firm receives dozens of applications every day from people trying to return. Of course, the market for other professionals is different. But most Canadians who leave come back pretty soon or later in life.
Joined: 3/14/2003
Posts: 9593
Posted on Thursday, November 20, 2003 2:12:00 PM
 
"There are just too many of us here who like what you call "Commie Krap" "

В этом и проблема.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, November 20, 2003 2:30:00 PM
 
ben: with all due respect- you are either really smart and evade all taxes or really stupid to believe all the stuff you are saying, or you might be crazy. (no offence intended)

You will be raising my taxes untill I leave? What about you? You will be paying more taxes too. Doesn't it bother you that you are being ripped off and raped day in and day out by the government that is dishing out the money left, right and center. What about that Lt Governor or smtn that spent 90 million dollars on taking some 80 people to Russia and Scandinavia on a "promotion tour" doen't it bother you?

and why do we need a promotion for Canada, if they decline most applications? I know so many people that tried to come here for a visit and their visas are declined... Waste of of m..f..n money.

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, November 20, 2003 2:30:00 PM
 
Сустанон : thank you, thats very true.
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Thursday, November 20, 2003 4:20:00 PM
 
Governments are actually not spending enough. We ourselves have constantly to contribute money to a variety of causes - arts, health research, homeless, handicapped, etc.

Racoon, how much did you contribute to charities last year or this year? Or you spent it all on yourself?

The difference between us is that I care about things other than my pockets. Even in Canada there are tons of people who cannot have a decent life for a variety of reasons.

Promotions trip was addressed to the Russians. So that Russians could do more business with Canada, and vice versa. It does not mean that it was just for tourism. Unfortunately, too many people are coming to Canada and stay illegally. So visas have to be refused.
Joined: 3/14/2003
Posts: 9593
Posted on Thursday, November 20, 2003 4:42:00 PM
 
"Even in Canada there are tons of people who cannot have a decent life for a variety of reasons."
Единственная "уважительная" причина - болезнь.
Все остальное - банальная лень и тунеядство.
Развели тут богадельню понимаешь.

Все коммунистические страны всегда сидели сидят и будут сидеть в говне.
А в Канаде дурдом - коммунизм для лентяев за счет работающих людей. Но увы. Коммунизм развращает. Желающих работать все меньше - половину денег приходится отгружать, плюс 15% налог на продажу (Онтарио). Тунеядцев все больше. Это бля дорога в никуда.

Таланты удирают в Штаты. А хули их винить? Где больше бабок? Когда канадский клуб выиграл Стэнли Кап в последний раз?
Бля если-б Джэймс Гослинг сидел бы в Канаде - хто бы про Джаву вообще слышал?

Да, еще есть солидная "база" созданная трудолюбивыми ВАСПами, (в меньшей мере - французами) и людьми разделившими их мировоззрение (те же украинцы завезенные сюда 100 лет назад и пр). Но увы. Эта "база" размывается с огромной скоростью.

И все эти "добряки" типа Бени - вкладывают в это "размывание" огромные усилия.
Joined: 11/4/2003
Posts: 16663
Posted on Thursday, November 20, 2003 4:46:00 PM
 
Сус,

волейдол?
Joined: 3/14/2003
Posts: 9593
Posted on Thursday, November 20, 2003 4:49:00 PM
 
псевдоним - ты ошиблась топиком :)
"я спокоен, я совершенно спокоен" гыгыгыгыг.

ЗЫ - "валидол" ваще-то.
Joined: 11/20/2003
Posts: 1
Posted on Thursday, November 20, 2003 4:50:00 PM
 
а может волейбол?

Joined: 11/4/2003
Posts: 16663
Posted on Thursday, November 20, 2003 4:51:00 PM
 
:))))))) ну да. в конце писма поставит "vale" ;)

я ..эт..был не прафф :) в работе. на проклятых шаспов, между про :)
Joined: 5/9/2003
Posts: 22950
Posted on Thursday, November 20, 2003 4:51:00 PM
 
Сустанон,

Новые иммигранты тоже вкалывают. Не все едут за вэлфером, а ВАСПов любителей оного тоже пруд пруди
Joined: 3/14/2003
Posts: 9593
Posted on Thursday, November 20, 2003 4:56:00 PM
 
Вовочка - речь о "старых" типа ВАСПах, построивших Канаду и Штаты.
Я-ж тоже типа иммигрант :)
Коммунарство разлагает всех - и васпов и не-васпов.
Даже трудолюбивые негры и то на велфере бывают гыгыгыгыг.
Joined: 5/9/2003
Posts: 22950
Posted on Thursday, November 20, 2003 4:58:00 PM
 
Недопонял сначала. Прошу дать возможность загладить, искупить...
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Thursday, November 20, 2003 5:28:00 PM
 
предлагаю в качестве первого шага в борьбе с разложением всем русским ездить на метро, а не на своих загрязняющих атмосферу машинах. а то совсем разленились, растолстели, отупели и тп....
Joined: 5/9/2003
Posts: 22950
Posted on Thursday, November 20, 2003 5:29:00 PM
 
Бенни,

А сюда метро не ходит. Что делать?
Joined: 11/13/2003
Posts: 3
Posted on Thursday, November 20, 2003 5:39:00 PM
 
Пешком ху---рить до метро а потом на метро далше...

хороший топик - много истины здесь. А канада - ето как мягкий couch, на котором все амбиции зацыпают крепким сном. Либо в Россию назад либо в Штаты надо, но с возрастом все болше начинаеш любит етот couch. It's so hard to choose, so hard to choose....
Joined: 6/13/2003
Posts: 221
Posted on Thursday, November 20, 2003 6:09:00 PM
 
our best doctors leave to work in US, because they get paid much more, same in other professions. You can not try to get rid of everyone that is not naively and blindly believes in this Commie Krap.

awesome one, ER, I agree 10000000% !
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Thursday, November 20, 2003 6:37:00 PM
 
The difference between us is that I care about things other than my pockets. Even in Canada there are tons of people who cannot have a decent life for a variety of reasons.

dude, I know you are trying hard to maintain the idea of yourself being somewhat intellectual, but listen to what you are saying.
(and don't be hypocritical by calling me my friend since you hate "conservative morons.")
Lemme tell ya, I probably have MUCH MORE experience working for the leftwing politicians than you ever imagined. Or seen. Or dreamed of. However, I choose my words carefully and I ll tell you this. Corruption is normal state of government at all of central government in all more less developing countries. That includes Russia. And Canada.
No money that is "fairly" collected in taxes will ever go directly for any of programs that you mentioned. Simply b/c there is "fees" and
"services."
Fooling ppl will always get them angry and will give a boot to all dirty politicians that get too greedy ahead of time, like pigs.

In order to have a healthy system that works you need to be open,
reliable(keep your promising), hardworking, professional, classy and
solid. But you can't just LIE and CHEAT the people that vote for you. Oh well, latest turnouts are in low 40ss... that doesn't represent anybody.

Anyway, common sense over partisan politics. that's my say.






Joined: 7/22/2003
Posts: 6734
Posted on Thursday, November 20, 2003 7:17:00 PM
 
Thor, thanks a lot!
И если Бен готов отдать свои деньги страждущим - лучший способ - организовать самому фонд.
Кстати, не слишком-то корректно упрекать других в нежелании потратиться на нуждающихся.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 12:29:00 AM
 
ben: Liberals are a virus and they have done nothing, but tax the living hell out of us, and they will continue.

I don't understand why we have to spend all this money to "help" other countries when there are more than 50% of people here are actually living below poverty levels.

Fuck this, start putting that money back into the economy and start helping hard working Canadians before start spending money on charity cases.

I seriously doubt that you will ever feed someone else before you will feed your family, your dog, cat, fish, hamster...
Joined: 11/29/2001
Posts: 19958
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 10:06:00 AM
 
Тор, не соглашусь с этим: No money that is "fairly" collected in taxes will ever go directly for any of programs that you mentioned. Simply b/c there is "fees" and
"services."

В Квебеке уже давно успешно работает программа day care for $5 a day. Как ты думаешь, откуда это финансируется?
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 10:15:00 AM
 
Если метро не ходит, переезжайте в город. Хватит жить по деревням - гетто, где одни русские.

Пардон, Енот, на меня деньги правительства тратят на всех уровнях. Я пользуюсь субсидированным метро каждый день, бесплатной медициной, доступной не только мне, но и тем людям, которые не зарабатывают так много денег, мой мусор убирают муниципальные власти, государство гарантирует мою безопасность (разве сравнить канадские города с американскими?), и тд, и тп.

А Руса мне правильно написала - все взгляды, высказываемые здесь Тором, Енотом и тп - это взгляды закоренелых холостяков, без родителей, детей, и тп. Кстати, неудивительно, что с такими взглядами, вы холостые - жадность бабы не любят:-)
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 10:28:00 AM
 
Руса,
я тебе потом отвечу, с похмелья бошка дико болит =)

бен,
в который раз ты ошибаешься... просто уму непостижимо...
я холостяк. спроси у любого моего друга-форумчанина, они тебе скажут, что я со своей гф уже как 18 месяцев живу...
ни фига себе холостяк.
Joined: 3/14/2003
Posts: 9593
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 10:31:00 AM
 
Хех, как же любят все эти бени переходить на личности :)
Ну что-ж. ОК.
Посмотрим....
Вот, скажем Беня написАл:
" совсем разленились, растолстели, отупели"

Беня - зачем по себе о других судить-то?
Хотя, конечно, твои детские аргументы пожалуй говорят в пользу твоего утверждения об "отупении".

Твой аргумент насчет метро - вообще детский лепет.
Но пожалуй снизойду на твой уровень аргументации.
Так вот, чек тзис аут - мне до ближайшей станции метро надо ехать часа 4.

Жадность? И это после твоей темы про ГАСТРОНОМ?
Да-с....

В общем, конечно, коммунары никогда интелектом не отличались - их метод спора это лозунги или переход на личность, но Беня даже этого толком сделать не может :)
Гуччи вон на порядок круче (каламбур-с) в этом плане.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 10:34:00 AM
 
или переход на личность, но Беня даже этого толком сделать не может :)
Гуччи вон на порядок круче (каламбур-с) в этом плане


что верно, то верно.
100%
Joined: 8/14/2003
Posts: 823
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 10:44:00 AM
 
I would agree with you except for separating "developing" countries - bureaucractic laws are the same everywhere. Its logic may seem twisted, unless you look at it from the future perspective.
A simple example: you are considering two candidates for your assistant's position. One is bright, energetic, hardworking, had no failures in the past. Another is dull, prefers managing public opinion to getting the work done, and you know for sure he has some dirt in his past (not covered by press btw.) Who would be your best choice? And where would you find yourself after 2-4 years? :)

BTW, have you read http://lib.ru/POLITOLOG/woslenskij.txt?
I strongly recommend chapter 3 as an example.
Joined: 10/10/2001
Posts: 9593
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 10:46:00 AM
 
беня, ты когда нибудь работал на государственные учреждения? мне довелось и поработать, и поработать с теми кто работает или работал. продуктивность и эфективность в таких учреждениях не на самом высоком уровне, и все это знают. Наличие программ и их эфективность во многом зависит от того как эфективно "тратятся" те самые тугрики шо мы все платим. Затрачивается немало средств чтоб раскрутить вот такую бюрократическую машину до того как она начнет давать какую-то пользу. есть такая фигня что называется cost/benefit ratio. Если мне надо индиректли потратить $50 шоб получить сервис на $10, так нахрен мне такой сервис нужен? Следует не только обращать внимание на предоставленные программы, а так же на то во что они обходятся, их эфективность и каким другим образом эти средства могли бы быть использованы. К сожелению, политические деяния и средства на них потраченные часто не совпадают с ожиданиями. Ошибки не компетентных людей стОят огромные деньги, и чем меньше я плачу за такие решения, тем меньше я имею против того кто их предпринимает.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 10:51:00 AM
 
pitachok,
exactly. fancing yourself being a petty intellectual is fine and dandy, but once it comes to real issues of handling serious matters of life as money, safety, stability etc things gotta fall in automatically. bankers work with money, firefighters are putting fires out, doctors curing people and so forth.

p.s. Did you know Гос Дума РФ ФС's yearly budget is 1/3 of Russia's budget ?

p.p.s. i m not going to tell you where that money goes... i ll spare ya. ;p
Joined: 11/29/2001
Posts: 19958
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 10:57:00 AM
 
Thor, не сравнивай Канаду с развитой социальной инфраструкторой и Рашку, у которой она практически отсутствует.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 11:20:00 AM
 
Руса,
то что в Канаде "развито" это коррупция власти, неважно какой партии, и девиз " не менять ничего в системе."
ужас. в Канаде самая устаревшая система из стран Commonwealth'a. А что здесь развито так это бюрократия и блат. Основные контракторы с фед. правительством находяцца в Квебеке, и приходят друзьями и приятелями с Кретьеном, Мартином и пр.
Уж что что, а блат тут поставлен неплохо.
Joined: 11/29/2001
Posts: 19958
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 11:21:00 AM
 
Thor, ты явно живешь не в той стране :)
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 11:36:00 AM
 
Тор,

деточка, на кого ты напал? Я не сравниваю Россию с Канадой, но решил проверил, насколько верны те сведения, которые ты тут используешь. Не поленился, нашел Федеральный закон от 24.12.2002 N 176-ФЗ "О федеральном бюджете на 2003 год"
на http://www.taxhelp.ru/hotdocs/40174.html

Пошел в Приложение 6 (РАСПРЕДЕЛЕНИЕ РАСХОДОВ ФЕДЕРАЛЬНОГО БЮДЖЕТА НА 2003 ГОД).

Вот статьи расходов. Так вот, не только на Думу, но на всю федеральную законодательную власть (включая, Совет Федерации) тратится ... 1.4 процента расходов бюджета страны, если мой калькулятор правильно посчитал.

ВСЕГО РАСХОДОВ 2345641398,0 тысяч
в том числе:
0102 Функционирование законодательных (представи-
тельных) органов государственной власти 3267837,9 тысяч

Вот хороший пример достоверности информации, которую ты тут распространяешь.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 11:41:00 AM
 
бен,
деточкой свою супругу называй, а не меня,

ты бы ещё на гугл.РУ сходил за "отчётами деятельности ГД РФ ФС, умник

Edited by - Thor on 11/21/2003 11:43:13 AM
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 11:46:00 AM
 
Тор, детский лепет, поэтому и называю деточкой. Будь мужчиной, признай, что с фактами у тебя напряженка, одна идеология.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 11:50:00 AM
 
деццкий лепет более присущ тебе. с твоими иллюзиями о социализме. думаешь я никогда социализм серьёзно не воспринимал как ед. форму правления ? хуюшки. на любую нацию интеллектуалов раз два и обчёлся, и кому же ты интересно доверил бы управлять страной ? оставьте иллюзии для детей, а розы для супруги, этот спор бесмысленнен.

п.с. факты тебе... те люди, которые располагали такими фактами, уже давно in a better place than here, поэтому не стебись своей статистикой с Сетки, уж я-то знаю как она туда попадает.
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 11:54:00 AM
 
хм, я думал, что ты понимаешь разницу, между статистикой и законом. Оказывается, пока нет...
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 12:00:00 PM
 
бен,
ты напоминаешь западного "эксперта" в вопросах региональной политики России, который забыл маленький элемент мафии...

Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 12:10:00 PM
 
Тор, но какой элемент мафии в Думе? Деньги распределяет и собирает правительство. Думе может и перепадают крохи, ну еще 3 процента, но не 30, как ты сказал. Если и воруют, то совершенно на другом уровне. Но тебе лишь бы ляпнуть. Как и все консерваторы, ты плохо "владеешь" цифрами и фактами.
Joined: 3/14/2003
Posts: 9593
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 12:38:00 PM
 
Ты смотри, оказываецца комунанары тоже поддаюцца дрессировке.
Вот уже Беня начал юзать фразу "детский лепет" вслед за мной.
Беня - вот тебе еще, для пополнения словарного запаса (и заодно для описАния твоих высказываний) :
"голимый вчес", "рамсы попутал", "прогнал", "как в лужу пернул".
Достаточно для начала, боюсь перегрузить твой детский неокрепший мозг.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 12:39:00 PM
 
при чём тут Дума... я те про общую ситуацию говорю...
а скрю ит... тяжёлый случай.
Joined: 11/29/2001
Posts: 19958
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 12:48:00 PM
 
Тор, приходи к нам на чай :)
Joined: 6/29/2003
Posts: 6857
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 12:59:00 PM
 
Rusa,
только ты чай по пластиковым стаканчикам разливай на всякий случай, и не горячий.
Joined: 10/8/2002
Posts: 816
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 12:59:00 PM
 
ben

Хотел тебе задать вопрос, как к эксперту в области закона и политики. Как тебе большая мароканская система управления?
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 1:31:00 PM
 
Сустанон,

Rusa обратила внимание на твое последнее сообщение. Извини, но я тут не всех сообщения читаю - нет времени. Тора читаю, а тебя нет. Не обижайся. Жизнь замотала.

Edited by - ben on 11/21/2003 1:32:50 PM
Joined: 3/14/2003
Posts: 9593
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 1:35:00 PM
 
Беня - да не, читать-то ты читаешь т.к. стал там про метро для борьбы с "разложением" вчесывать или вот про деццкий лепет...
Ответить пока не можешь? Ничего страшного. Читай, просвещайся у тебя еще все впереди :)
Joined: 11/8/2003
Posts: 61
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 1:37:00 PM
 
по твоему сообщению можно понять, что все русски выражения и слэнг придумал ты, и мы их у тебя повзаимствовали, не спросив разрешения. Абсурд какой-то.
Joined: 3/14/2003
Posts: 9593
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 1:42:00 PM
 
Кларика - я так понял это мне адресовано?
Ну почему-же. Вот, скажем я написАл мол комунарство разлагает, Беня тут же с предложением ездить на метро шобы типа не разлагацца... Как же он не прочитав мой пост на него ответил?
Ну и про децкий лепет оч. подозрительно, токо я эту фразу употребил, Беня тут как тут гонит на Тора этой фразой.
Гыгггыг.
Joined: 11/8/2003
Posts: 61
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 1:46:00 PM
 
ax ну да, гыгыгыг тоже твое творчество
Joined: 3/14/2003
Posts: 9593
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 1:46:00 PM
 
Гыгыгыгыгыг.
Беня отредактировал свое последнее сообщение шобы хоть как-то мэйкать сэнс. Хахаха.
Зэтс факин пасэтик.
Joined: 3/14/2003
Posts: 9593
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 1:48:00 PM
 
Кларика - причем тут гыгыгыг.
У тебя есть шо сказать по существу?
Да - пиши, нет - не пиши. Флэйм не разводи на пустом месте.
Joined: 11/8/2003
Posts: 61
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 1:52:00 PM
 
пока что во всем топике ты как-раз ничего толкового не сказал. Все гыгыг да гыгыг, лишь бы доебаться (да простят меня модераторы) до бена. Поучись у Тора.
Joined: 3/14/2003
Posts: 9593
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 1:54:00 PM
 
Кларика - ну уж не тебе с твоим флэймом судить сказал ли я что-нибудь толковое или нет.
Joined: 11/8/2003
Posts: 61
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 1:57:00 PM
 
не хочешь правды, не надо, но до бена с Тором тебе далеко, только и можешь потявкивать фром тайм то тайм.
Joined: 6/29/2003
Posts: 6857
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 2:01:00 PM
 
-- Апчхи!
-- Будьте здоровы.
-- Спасибо.
-- Не за что.
-- Не умничай!
-- Пошёл на хуй!
Joined: 7/30/2002
Posts: 28
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 2:02:00 PM
 
Гыгыгыгыгы
Joined: 3/14/2003
Posts: 9593
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 2:04:00 PM
 
Кларика - ну е-мае. Ты тут в этом топике только и тявкаешь на меня, вынуждаешь расходовать мой невьебезный интеллект гыгг на беседу с тобой. Пойди прочитай топик с самого начала.

Пойми (понимаю - для тебя это нелегко, но постарайся) с такими бенями нормальный спор - невозможен, когда у них нет аргументов (то есть - всегда) они или переходят на личности или пишут херню типа "я твоих постов не читал" после того как на эти самы посты отвечают.
"до бени с Тором" ? Гыг. Для Тора это должно быть весьма оскорбительно...
Joined: 11/8/2003
Posts: 61
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 2:08:00 PM
 
здесь ни с кем спор невозможен. Точка.
Joined: 5/9/2003
Posts: 22950
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 2:09:00 PM
 
Clarica,

А я не согласен, давай поспорим о чём нибудь
Joined: 3/14/2003
Posts: 9593
Posted on Friday, November 21, 2003 2:10:00 PM
 
кларика - ну точка или запятая это как говорицца неизвестно.
гыгыг.
спор тут вполне возможен, другое дело шо он как правило бесполезен - это да.
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Monday, November 24, 2003 6:47:00 PM
 
Наконец-то Либералы стали реализовывать свою программу. И так уже достаточно показали свое нежелание идти против интересов жирных корпоративных котов. Никому, кроме НДП, доверять нельзя - все на игле у BS

Ontario Liberals move to roll back tax cuts

Canadian Press

Toronto — Ontario's new Liberal government introduced key legislation Monday to roll back corporate tax cuts and cancel other personal tax credits as it wrestles with a projected $5.6-billion deficit.

The legislation, which would also scrap the private-school tax credit and axe a property tax break for seniors, fulfils a promise made by the Liberals in the campaign for the Oct. 2 election. The bill also takes the first step toward raising Ontario's tobacco taxes to the national average.

“It's an important step towards keeping our core commitment to get the province's financial house back in order,” said Finance Minister Greg Sorbara, as he introduced the legislation, entitled the Fiscal Responsibility Act.

“We made that commitment because it's the foundation of everything else that Ontarians want us to do. That includes excellence in education, improving our health-care system, strengthening our communities and obviously creating a more prosperous economy,” Mr. Sorbara said.

The proposed bill “speaks to what is the most important job of our government — strengthening the foundation for change,” he said.

Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Monday, November 24, 2003 7:12:00 PM
 
hehehehe

bs

a week ago, someone exposed that there is no deficit and Liberals said "uhh.. well there is not deficit now, but it was projected to the end of the year."

so my question here to logic people here, lets see all the sides of the pie:

Liberals come in = no deficit
Liberals say deficit = 5.6 bil projected to end of year
conclusion: Liberals planned to steal that money.

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment

Edited by - Evil raccoon on 11/24/2003 7:14:06 PM
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Monday, November 24, 2003 7:25:00 PM
 
Racoon,

the Conservatives acknowledged the deficit a few weeks ago. They say they did not have enough tome to sell assets to cover it... So they were planning to sell public property to their buddies on Bay Street to balance the books... And we all will have to pay for it by increased fees for basic services...
Joined: 7/22/2003
Posts: 6734
Posted on Monday, November 24, 2003 8:02:00 PM
 
2 бен:
Есть 2 персонажа - один литературный, другой - исторический.
1.Шариков, предлагавший все поделить
2.Савва Морозов. Тот самый, который поддерживал и финансировал социалистов. Покончил самоубийством.

бен, если тебе некуда девать твои деньги и в одном месте свербит кому-нибудь помочь - построй счастье какой-нибудь отдельно взятой семье, возьми на себя финансовые обязательства и вперед. Чего всех-то в коммуну сгонять?
А вот когда конкретно попробуешь, тогда и поговорим.
И вообще, ветка называлась "Conservative review", чего ты как банный лист к заднице прилип к топику со своими НДП?
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Monday, November 24, 2003 8:38:00 PM
 
ben: u must be pretty fucking rich if you have the spear cash to throw around, unfortunately not many share your views or your paycheque (yet)

Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Monday, November 24, 2003 8:38:00 PM
 
ben: u better work hard, thousands of welfarers depend on you.
Joined: 10/1/2003
Posts: 6154
Posted on Monday, November 24, 2003 9:23:00 PM
 
Собственно говоря звучит как довольно радикальные меры. Интересно бы узнать детали. Я лично от либералов никакого
социализма не ожидал. Так оно и получается. Отмена некотырых актов сейчас достаточно правильный шаг с политической точки зрения. В примере с электричеством
лучше сейчас чем в 2006. Там их будут по результатам оценивать. Правда есть шансы того что они заработают репутацию людей которые босают слова на ветер а потом делают наоборрот. Треп насчет того что они не дооценили ситуацию звучит несовсем убедительно.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Monday, November 24, 2003 10:10:00 PM
 
ничё,
ща долтон от**сёт по полной программе от профсоюзов.
сёдня босс пришёл с дельты или шератона, там все юнион bawses (nu yawkah fo boss) собирают полки на него.

it has just begun =)
Joined: 7/7/2002
Posts: 1297
Posted on Tuesday, November 25, 2003 8:52:00 AM
 
Пора ударяться в политику, млин. Долой либералов. Кстати, интересно, раз они не выполняют ни одного предвыборного обещания, насколько законным является их пребывание у власти? То есть, нельзя ли это опротестовать как-нибудь? Вас выбирали по конкретной программе, раз вы её не выполняете, целиком и полностью отказались от всего, то какого хрена? :-)
Буду организовать правую партию. Кто со мной? Бена оформим адвокатом на общественных началах. No conflict of interest there, for sure :-)
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Friday, December 19, 2003 5:41:00 PM
 
Well, that is serious... The thing is, though, that the social conservatives of the Alliance will have to form a new party again because Bernie is certainly a red Tory:-)


Lord gearing up for run at leadership of new Conservative party

ALEXANDER PANETTA

OTTAWA (CP) - New Brunswick Premier Bernard Lord is prepared to seek the leadership of the new Conservative Party of Canada and could announce his decision over the holidays, sources from across the country said Friday.

Lord has been besieged with phone calls from top Tory organizers urging him to make a move that could have a significant impact on next year's federal election.

Sources said the young, socially moderate, fluently bilingual premier is now gearing up to enter the federal ring and added it's just a matter of time before he makes it official.

Lord was non-committal Friday but clearly had warmed to entering federal politics. His once-firm reply of "No" whenever he was asked about the leadership has now morphed into, "I'm listening."

"I'm certainly receiving calls and I'm listening to what they're saying," Lord told reporters in Fredericton.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Friday, December 19, 2003 9:54:00 PM
 
бля я сегодня слышал что Магинти отменил 5и летний ревью квалификаций для учитилей ... пиздетц.. вобщем в ближайщее время дети как были дибилами так и останутся.. и будут следуйщими Либералами...
Joined: 10/19/2003
Posts: 16244
Posted on Friday, December 26, 2003 10:13:00 PM
 
Народ!

Кто знает. как связаться с местной штаб-квартирой этой самой новой консервативной партии?
А то надо сдвинуть русскоязычных вправо, если они не хотят суда шариата и т.д.
Joined: 11/29/2001
Posts: 19958
Posted on Wednesday, January 21, 2004 10:07:00 AM
 
Хотелось бы услышать от right-wing-morons (ЕНТО Я ЛЮБЯ!) мнение по поводы предвыборной кандидатуры Белинды Стронак.
Joined: 9/3/2001
Posts: 22722
Posted on Wednesday, January 21, 2004 10:09:00 AM
 
Анархию давай
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, January 21, 2004 11:33:00 AM
 
Belinda вперёд =)
меньше налогов, closer ties with America, военку поднимать, экономику.

слишком консервативных голосователей она пугает тем, что она за same sex marriages. однако против декриминализации марихуаны.

узнаем побольше расскажем.

а ничё зарплата была, 9.2 мил в год. тоже мне public high school and rich daddy.
Joined: 3/25/2002
Posts: 2486
Posted on Wednesday, January 21, 2004 11:41:00 AM
 
I don't give a flying hoot about her salary. $9.2M is nothing compared to some Wall Street honchos. Anyway, her biggest disadvantage is that she'd never held a public office. In Canada, where everyone is paranoid about the experience, it's going to be a pretty tough sell for her. Besides that, she smart, conservative and cute:)
Joined: 11/29/2001
Posts: 19958
Posted on Wednesday, January 21, 2004 11:45:00 AM
 
Ну енто мы и так все знаем, а какие прогнозы?
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, January 21, 2004 11:45:00 AM
 
PoS,
you meant Bay street cronies, lol. we got no Wall Street in Canada, EH =))

Yeah I agree, we'll see if she is up to the challenge.
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Wednesday, January 21, 2004 2:36:00 PM
 
Yeah, Go, Belinda, Go... Give Stephen Harper a ride for the raised money:-)

Anyway, at least she is socially liberal and supports same-sex marriages...

As for salary, it is meaningless to compare salaries - Magna is controlled by her daddy... She of course was no real CEO, but anyway...
Joined: 11/29/2001
Posts: 19958
Posted on Wednesday, January 21, 2004 2:45:00 PM
 
беня, я надеюсь, что ты так же позаботишься о своих дочках, как и папашка Белинды
Joined: 3/25/2002
Posts: 2486
Posted on Wednesday, January 21, 2004 2:52:00 PM
 
No, ben will donate all his savings to Communist party of Canada:)
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, January 21, 2004 2:58:00 PM
 
yeah... right !

p.s. Rusa, so benny is gonna have little girls, little daddy's girls =)

Joined: 11/29/2001
Posts: 19958
Posted on Wednesday, January 21, 2004 3:04:00 PM
 
Тор, у тебя тоже деффки будут :) деффки рулез :)
Joined: 10/10/2001
Posts: 9593
Posted on Wednesday, January 21, 2004 3:11:00 PM
 
Тор, от жены не зависит кто будет, так как у них тока Х, а вот пт мужика - да, у нас ведь ХУ....


ПС Вы ещё про Магну не раз услышите
Joined: 10/10/2001
Posts: 9593
Posted on Wednesday, January 21, 2004 3:12:00 PM
 
хде Тора пост?
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, January 21, 2004 3:15:00 PM
 
сорри, питачок, сам потёр ;п

там было что : "Руса, с чего ты взяла, что деффки будут ? если следовать логике : - у бенни и у меня деффки, то значит оттого что жАна одна и та же была =))) гыгы."

а теперь ты меня и исправил. =)
Joined: 11/29/2001
Posts: 19958
Posted on Wednesday, January 21, 2004 3:18:00 PM
 
Тор, вот когда у тебя родится деффка, лет так через 5, то вспомнишь ты мои слова! :) Я как Ванга - все знаю.
Joined: 10/10/2001
Posts: 9593
Posted on Wednesday, January 21, 2004 3:21:00 PM
 
как говорила одна моя coworker, чтобы быть увереным что будет мальчик, надо в кровать ложиться в ботинках...канадская логика. Следуя такой логике, если лечь в ластах, то русалка получится. Один знакомый ложился в охотничем обмундировании, хотел шоб охотник родился. Охотника не получилось, зато у него рога выросли
Joined: 3/14/2003
Posts: 9593
Posted on Wednesday, January 21, 2004 3:26:00 PM
 
- Я падазреваю шо мне жэна изменяет с плотником
- почему?
- прихажу дамой а тама апилки, стружки фсякие
- ааааа.... а я падазреваю шо моя изменяет с жылезнодорожником
- да? пачиму?
- да вот бля, прихажу дамой, а там - жылезнодорожник.

гыггыгы.

Joined: 10/19/2003
Posts: 16244
Posted on Wednesday, January 21, 2004 8:53:00 PM
 
А эта Белинда от каких консерваторов - совсем новых или от Кларка и пр?
Joined: 9/10/2002
Posts: 7576
Posted on Thursday, January 22, 2004 10:24:00 AM
 
Вчера я прочитал несколько статей про Белинду в Toronto Star. В одной из них, журналист разнёс Белинду в пух и прах.

Шансов на победу у неё в этом году практически никаких. Политического опыта имеется ноль. Позорно завалила вопросы журналистов о том как Канаде следовало вести себя по поводу военной кампании в Ираке. Дважды замужем, и дважды разведена. Двое детей. 38 лет. Кое-какие взгляды очень сильно противоречат взглядам закоренелых консерваторов. У неё всего 6 недель на то чтобы победить - практически невозможно за такой срок сделать себе политический капитал.

Если она действительно серъёзна думает о своей полит-карьере то может быть к следующим выборам и будет иметь шанс.

Кстати, оказывается Белинда из Авроры, и до этого Вторника была CEO of Magna International :)

--
Munits.com
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Thursday, January 22, 2004 10:48:00 AM
 
It is wrong to say that there are just two factions in the newly formed ConsPartCan (CPC) - red tories (a la Clark and Bill Davis, former Ontario premier) and hard-core, Bush-style conservatives. The spectrum is much broader. It especially applies to social issues.

Belinda is certainly more socially liberal that the other two candidates, and she may appeal to a large number of conservatives, especially in Ontario (which is the key to making CPC a national, rather than regional, party). The truth is that social conservatism has very little appeal generally among more prosperous people and younger people - it is largely a province of older/lower-middle class (angry white) men...
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, January 22, 2004 10:59:00 AM
 
I don't thik she is so socially inclined, she looks pretty tough except of the faggot 'marriage' issue. I always prefer my politician businessman rather than lawyers.

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, January 22, 2004 11:04:00 AM
 
я чтото краем уха вчера слышал что Макгинти решил не делать чтото на Вотерфранте, чтото что он обещал. Вот Пиздун, за такое ваще судить надо.

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 3/13/2003
Posts: 487
Posted on Thursday, January 22, 2004 11:24:00 AM
 
McGuinty пока исполнил только одно своё обещание: поднять налоги (то есть отменить понижение налогов, что в общем тоже самое). До остального он пока еще не дошел...
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Thursday, January 22, 2004 11:31:00 AM
 
Well, ER, Belinda is not your girl then... First of all, she is a business woman, not a business man. But, more importantly, she is only her daddy's girl - appointed CEO of the company in which her daddy holds a controlling interest. In that regard she is a total fake...

I love, ER, when you make comments about gays... It makes me wish I were less straight:-)
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, January 22, 2004 11:38:00 AM
 
ben: pardon me: business man, woman whatever..
(P/C is a study of how to talk to niggers)

I didn't get your gay crack, so lets move on..


Lets review something:

W. Bush was a daddy's girl too and he ran 3 companies into bankruptsy. Now he is the President of US of A. Not bad, eh?

It doesn't really matter if the oportunity to be a businessman (or woman) was given to you or taken by you, its what do you do with that? She knows business and she had success over the years, thats what matters.

You don't need to be a genius to be a polititian, you need charisma, or if you choose to be Liberal, you need 3 rd Grade education and a pulse.



--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Thursday, January 22, 2004 11:40:00 AM
 
The only thing that Dubya proves, ER, that it does not take any brains or talents to be the US president... Even running a small company requires more - that is why Dubya was such a spectacular failure in that...

Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Thursday, January 22, 2004 11:48:00 AM
 
(don't have a luxury of time ) : one thing Belinda will bring to the table of a new CPC is a new image. Socially liberal and is more acceptable to (ben is rite ~ ontarians (their vote determines quite a lot)) centrist voters; liberal conservatives.

it's PC over and over again. She has no ties to Joe Clark, but shares a lot with is social platform. Though she's got more guts and fresh support than Joe( who should retire as a Liberal anyway)
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, May 19, 2004 9:55:00 AM
 
So...
I already asked this question : but how much support Paul Martin just lost with the latest Ontario budget ?

Every promise is broken, the taxes are raised without voter referendum, multiple deficits are gonna be ran, higher fees in basic services are also introduced with more to come.

Seems like the Liberals are screwing their own voters who might just turn their back on them come election.

Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, May 19, 2004 9:58:00 AM
 
interesting picture on the 1st page of the Sun
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, May 19, 2004 10:00:00 AM
 
r
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, May 19, 2004 10:02:00 AM
 
I think Im gonna move to Montreal, noone does shit there and all Ontarios money is there anyway.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, May 19, 2004 10:03:00 AM
 
BINGO!
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, May 19, 2004 10:03:00 AM
 
гыгы, шучу,
на самом деле в Монреале дела ещё похуже, но они умеют жить joie de vivre
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, May 27, 2004 11:09:00 AM
 
Layton blames Toronto homeless deaths on Martin

TORONTO - NDP Leader Jack Layton came under fire on Thursday for comments he made blaming Paul Martin for the deaths of homeless people in Toronto.

Layton was speaking at the nomination meeting for his wife Olivia Chow on Wednesday in Toronto, when he launched an attack on the Liberal leader.



blabla

"Deaths due to homelessness in this city took a rapid rise immediately after Paul Martin cancelled the affordable housing program, and their names stand in testimony to the neglect that has been rained on our city," Layton said.

Some 400 supporters at a downtown church in the Trinity-Spadina riding Chow is contesting cheered his remarks.

Afterward, Layton visited a memorial to Toronto homeless who died on the streets.

The Liberal party dismissed the accusation, demanding an apology from Layton to people who live in poverty. It said his comments cheapened the debate over how to help the homeless.

Furor over Layton's comments threatened to drown out Conservative Leader Stephen Harper's attack on the Liberals.

Harper said Wednesday night that the Liberals were trying to whip up anti-American feelings during the election campaign.

He was commenting on reports yesterday that two Canadian citizens were allegedly involved in an al-Qaeda cell reportedly planning an attack in the United States.

Harper said Canada must co-operate fully with the U.S. on security issues, adding it was irresponsible for anyone to say anything smacking of anti-Americanism during the election campaign.

The Liberals should withdraw an election ad accusing him of having a pro-U.S. agenda.

In the clip in question, Martin says: "We want to be different. We don't want to be American, we want to be Canadians ...." The Liberals retorted that their clips were about Harper, not the U.S., and that they would not be pulled.




--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 3/25/2002
Posts: 2486
Posted on Thursday, May 27, 2004 2:35:00 PM
 
I can't stand "silver spoon" socialists like Layton and his idiotic wife.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Thursday, May 27, 2004 2:37:00 PM
 
or Paul Martin
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Thursday, May 27, 2004 2:47:00 PM
 
Yeah, right. It is because socialism is really for people who grew up in wealthy and successful families, а не для тех, кто из грязи в князи. Редко кто бывает щедрым, когда последний член без соли доедает...
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Thursday, May 27, 2004 2:50:00 PM
 
кстати с точностью наоборот
когда есть чем поделицца намного приятнее делицца
я из жизни заметил чем беднее чел, тем больше он жмёцца.
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Thursday, May 27, 2004 2:57:00 PM
 
Тор, перечитай, что написал. Какое же с точностью до наоборот? Когда пишешь то же, что и я...
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Thursday, May 27, 2004 3:00:00 PM
 
гыгыг ;п
тем не менее политики выбранные в гос. аппарат распоряжаюцца не личными финансовыми средствами, а фондами налогоплательщиков, бюджетами собранных налогов.
Joined: 1/30/2003
Posts: 22206
Posted on Thursday, May 27, 2004 3:01:00 PM
 
No, socializm is for a bunch of lazy fat-ass no-good-at-anything wannabes...
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Thursday, May 27, 2004 3:07:00 PM
 
So they were planning to sell public property to their buddies on Bay Street to balance the books

please remind me, but who was it trying to sell LCBO, TVO ?
and the deficit was there BECAUSE Federal Fiberals were screwing Harris and Toronto by not injecting any cash back from taxes !


Edited by - Thor on 5/27/2004 3:07:43 PM
Joined: 3/25/2002
Posts: 2486
Posted on Thursday, May 27, 2004 3:08:00 PM
 
Kam,
You're on the roll, dude. You're turning into a fine Republican gentleman. One of these days, I will see you in a tuxedo with a fine cigar and a bottle of the best scotch:)))

Thor,
ben is without Rusa right now, so he has a hightened level of sexual frustration.
Joined: 10/1/2003
Posts: 6154
Posted on Thursday, May 27, 2004 11:58:00 PM
 
and the deficit was there BECAUSE Federal Fiberals were screwing Harris and Toronto by not injecting any cash back from taxes !

Thor, I cannot believe... this is a la Paul Martin statement. :)))))

It is just pointing fingers at each other. Also, this statement denies any credit to Martin for cutting taxes. Are only Tories allowed to cut taxes? I am calling this political racism. :)

Joined: 5/22/2002
Posts: 2632
Posted on Friday, May 28, 2004 12:31:00 AM
 
***You're on the roll, dude. You're turning into a fine Republican gentleman. One of these days, I will see you in a tuxedo with a fine cigar and a bottle of the best scotch:)))***

PoS, can you be even more pompous and self-important ;-)? How old are you dude? It's like you live in Charleston 100 yrs ago he he and all of that just bcause a guy shares your political preferences.
Do you also keep a set of dueling pistols somewhere and enjoy julep on a hot summer day he he? Just wondering where you picked it up since you seem to share some part of your heritage with ppl here which is nowhere close to your way of presenting yourself.
I don't mind conservatives just can't believe your "good job, sonny" attitude.
Joined: 5/22/2002
Posts: 2632
Posted on Friday, May 28, 2004 12:33:00 AM
 
that was just an observation :-) he he

Edited by - marmelot on 5/28/2004 12:33:22 AM
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Friday, May 28, 2004 9:59:00 AM
 
Layton is the worst of them all. He is trying so hard, it became annoying. He even married a chinese chick to look cool and attract chinese votes. Over the last few days he blamed a lot of people for a lot of different things, but I think it came down to:

Liberals - thiefs and liars.

Tories- lesser of 2 evils.

NDP - a total joke of a party with no clear political agenta. Remind me of a teenager who tries to get laid.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Friday, May 28, 2004 10:03:00 AM
 
marx, really, you are soooo offfffff, I can't even debate, that'd be too unfair.


--
touche
Joined: 3/25/2002
Posts: 2486
Posted on Friday, May 28, 2004 10:18:00 AM
 
A deranged teenager who wants to get laid, I would say.

I like you comment about Jack's marrying Olivia Chao. What a joke. It's not a bona fide marriage, but rather a cheap form of political partnership. Indeed, a true representatives of Nation's Dumbest People.
It still pisses me off to see how much media coverage these two schmucks get.
Joined: 1/30/2003
Posts: 22206
Posted on Friday, May 28, 2004 10:23:00 AM
 
PofS, Не... Республиканцем я не стану. Я поддерживаю дерьморкрадов и Эл Гора на самом деле, он - приличный и умный человек, а Буша я ненавижу.

Республиканцев тут поддерживают военные, рэднэки, богатые люди. А средний класс и интеллигенция завсегда были дерьмократические...
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Friday, May 28, 2004 10:26:00 AM
 
PM plans gas tax sharing

OTTAWA (CP) - A long-awaited plan to share gas tax revenues with cities is expected to be announced by Prime Minister Paul Martin Friday, who will say that if elected, his government will shape a deal to divvy up the money by the end of the year.

Martin will also announce that the Green Municipal Investment Fund, for which he provided seed money as finance minister, has sparked $1 billion worth of environmentally friendly projects across Canada, sources say.

Martin is to make the announcements at the annual meeting of the Federation of Canadian Municipalities (FCM), in Edmonton.

"When the prime minister is talking about building on the partnership with cities, he's talking about the gas tax," said one source.

"The PM wants to talk to the cities about the mechanism needed to transfer gasoline tax revenues to them. He wants to reach a deal by the end of the year."

Environmentalists and municipal planners

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Politics/CanadaVotes/2004/05/27/475843-cp.html

...so what he is actually saying is "Gas prices will not be lower, we will not cut the taxes, fuck you, citizens."

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 3/25/2002
Posts: 2486
Posted on Friday, May 28, 2004 10:29:00 AM
 
Kamich,
You may become a libertarian i.e. someone who stands for small taxes and as little as possible government control in everyday lives of citizens.
The biggest problem with Dems is that they stand for the big government. "The best government is the one that governs the least" - TJ.
You're wrong in regards of rednecks. Up until the last election, because of their poor economic status, they would support the Dems. Only the gun control issue was able to put them into the Republican camp.
You would be surprised, but lots of middle class people support the GOP.
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Friday, May 28, 2004 10:48:00 AM
 
"It's not a bona fide marriage, but rather a cheap form of political partnership."

Really, that is just disgusting, I think, really, really bad taste... I do not know where you people live, but where I live it is considered quite normal to marry a person of a dirrent race or ethnicity. Shame on both ER and PoS for such comments...
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Friday, May 28, 2004 10:54:00 AM
 
кстати, должен согласиться с Камом. Никто так не повлиял на мои политические взгляды, как республиканцы. Только когда видишь весь абсурд их политических и моральных устоев можешь стать социалистом, что со мной и произошло. Это нацисты сегодняшнего дня, которые представляют самую большую угрозу для человечества, потому что имеют доступ к невероятному разрушительному потенциалу и огромным финансовым ресурсам. Поэтому любое их поражение, включая полный крах в Ираке, совершенно необходимы для восстановления баланса сил и интересов в мире.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Friday, May 28, 2004 10:57:00 AM
 
Really, that is just disgusting, I think, really, really bad taste... I do not know where you people live, but where I live it is considered quite normal to marry a person of a dirrent race or ethnicity. Shame on both ER and PoS for such comments...


That really is so sweet. Well good for you if you believe in this facade, but I don't buy it. Thank god he wasn't stupid enough to marry a black lesbian cross dresser.
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Friday, May 28, 2004 11:00:00 AM
 
By the way, ER, you are missing a lot if you never hooked up with black women... White chicks are no match:-) Of course, I am still waiting to meet a black lesbian but even straights are amazing:-)
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Friday, May 28, 2004 11:05:00 AM
 
when gentiles make racist comments I am not surprised... but when Jews make the kind of comments that ER has just made, I am just appalled... Racism among Jews is particularly sick... It is like slaves are trying to imitate their masters...

Edited by - ben on 5/28/2004 11:05:16 AM
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Friday, May 28, 2004 11:06:00 AM
 
ben, been there, done that, didn't like.

Maybe you hung out with wrong white chicks, or you are not so good yourself...
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Friday, May 28, 2004 11:10:00 AM
 
ben: I'm sorry, that was not racism. I don't have a problem with her as a person. I just think the fact that he married her helped him in his career, and one sometimes wonders... This is not racism.
Joined: 3/25/2002
Posts: 2486
Posted on Friday, May 28, 2004 11:15:00 AM
 
It's funny to hear the accusations of racism from a nazzi pig himself i.e ben. I recall your "kind" words in Thor's direction in regards of his nationality and political views. As for Layton, it's pretty low to marry someone in order to get some political favours from a certain race. That's the worst form of racial exploitation. I don't see too many people of color in top NDP positions. What's wrong with this picture?
Joined: 1/30/2003
Posts: 22206
Posted on Friday, May 28, 2004 11:20:00 AM
 
Во... в кои то веки соглашусь с Беном... Ни что так не радует меня, как неудачи республиканцев ; ) They made Gore's job so fucking easy ; )
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Friday, May 28, 2004 11:26:00 AM
 
As much as I think that Bush is a fuckin goof, I see Kerry as even bigger goof. The guy is a joke. When I see him on TV I cry laughing. Who writes his stuff, Drew Carry?

Him and Layton should marry.
Joined: 5/28/2004
Posts: 13
Posted on Friday, May 28, 2004 11:34:00 AM
 
I think the conservatives are the best in fitting most people expectations, NDP are simply another word for communism (take from the rich and give to the poor),
Liberals are the "middle class", but how McGinty "did not rase taxes", making the liberals theifs and liars.
The conservatives support USA and against big % of walfare and etc.

Regardless, it all depends on the financial status an individual stands in currently.
Joined: 3/25/2002
Posts: 2486
Posted on Friday, May 28, 2004 11:34:00 AM
 
They asked Kerry if he contradicted his environmental views by owning three SUV's. He answered smth. to the extend of I don't own any of these SUV's, but my family does. What a hypocritical dunce.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Friday, May 28, 2004 11:35:00 AM
 
Honestly, ER, you can sound very radical and arrogant sometimes. I care less who Olivia Chao is, but it seems you guys go after her b/c of their, must admit, very PR relationship.

I agree on the leftwing hysteria in the mass media, but then the only alternative to it was Sir Conrad Black that was pretty much kicked out of business, country, society.

p.s. just a suggestion, please stop discussing ppl's nationalities and the likes it's a POLITICAL topic, а не местячковые обсуждения национальностей и предрассудков.

ben, I fully agree on your gentile and jewish racism comments.

--
touche
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Friday, May 28, 2004 11:36:00 AM
 
F Kerry, what a joke. Guy is just another Skull & Bonesmen trying to get a raise ;p
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Friday, May 28, 2004 11:39:00 AM
 
InJector, I like the way you post in English, I mean I can understand, for Chrissake! Keep it up. However, you probably meant welfare ?

Well, Conservatives aren't exactly pro-American, they are pro-freedom and that what makes them seem pro-States.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Friday, May 28, 2004 11:42:00 AM
 
Thor: I actually hate only arabs, with a passion, but they are the same race as me, so I am not really a racist.

If you want to dig down and deep, Russia is the place that taught me racism, not Canada or Israel.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Friday, May 28, 2004 11:47:00 AM
 
Dude, no shit. =)

--
touche
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Friday, May 28, 2004 2:04:00 PM
 
ER, you are absolutely right - Russia is one of the most racist countries...

I understand that Jews and Arabs have different interests but I absolutely hate (:-) when this difference in interests is translated into hatred for each other. I every day deal with people who have interests differing from my own but so what? They are right and I am right, each from own perspective. Why hate each other? I would love them but I respect their interests.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Monday, May 31, 2004 2:06:00 PM
 
TRENTON, Ont. (CP) -- Conservative Leader Stephen Harper used a backdrop of grey-painted transport planes at a sprawling southern Ontario air base to promise more money and troops for the military Monday.

At a campaign stop just outside CFB Trenton, he said a Conservative government would immediately put $1.2 billion more into the defence budget and add 20,000 troops to the ranks.

It would beef up the army with tanks, give the navy hybrid helicopter carriers and provide upgraded CF-18 fighter-bombers and new transport planes.

"Our plan for the Canadian Armed Forces is both strategically necessary and economically affordable," he said.

The Forces now have an authorized strength of 60,000, but can only muster about 52,000 trained troops.

He said the transfusion won't remake the military overnight, but will start the rebuilding process.


Harper's defence promises came as he opened the second week of the campaign for the June 28 federal election.

The Liberals provided $600 million more for the military in the last budget and have promised more cash for new supply ships, among other projects. But they have also said that any major funding increase will have to await the findings of a defence and foreign policy review later this year.

The NDP immediately attacked Harper's defence-spending plan, saying he really wants a bigger army so Canada can join the U.S. in places such as Iraq.

"He's never seen an American war he didn't want Canada to join," the party said in a news release.

Harper planned to spend much of the week in southern and eastern Ontario, seeking to capitalize on the political fallout from the provincial Liberal budget.

Premier Dalton McGuinty's first budget imposed health care premiums and shattered his election promise of no new taxes without a referendum.

That left Prime Minister Paul Martin smarting, as people lashed out at the nearest Liberal -- federal or otherwise.

Harper strategists say the Ontario budget fallout gives the federal Conservatives hope and a possible beachhead in Ontario.

The Tories may have lost a good chance in Newfoundland on Monday when John Crosbie, the razor-tongued former federal cabinet minister, announced formally that he wouldn't run for a St. John's seat.


--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Monday, May 31, 2004 2:17:00 PM
 
I every day deal with people who have interests differing from my own but so what?

..so am I.. but I think your perspective would change when these people's only interest is to kill you.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Monday, May 31, 2004 3:05:00 PM
 
Notorious provincial budget is costing the Federal Liberals tons of support. According to the latest EKOS(toronto star pro-liberal paper) 56% wouldn't vote Liberal in upcoming fed. elections on June 28th. THe only province that really matters in fed. elections( we don't have proportional representation in this country as in the States, France and such)is Ontario and it is no secret that whoever Ontario votes for gets elected. However, this time seems like ontarians are ought to punish Martin for McGuinty's ruinous agenda.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Monday, May 31, 2004 3:18:00 PM
 
Amen!
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Monday, May 31, 2004 3:54:00 PM
 
but what will be situation if we get a liberal minority gov't? It will be worse for conservatives b/c NDP will be the king maker and the Bloc may have a say as well (and they are as socially progressive as the NDP). Naturally, no one now believes that we can get a conservative minority government...
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Monday, May 31, 2004 4:02:00 PM
 
во!!!.. в анекдотах нашел !!!

Спорить с юристом - все равно, что обливать грязью свинью: через некоторое время вы понимаете, что свинья действительно получает удовольствие.
Joined: 1/30/2003
Posts: 22206
Posted on Monday, May 31, 2004 5:09:00 PM
 
Тор, Ракун, вам действительно еще не остоеБЕНили эти споры?
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Monday, May 31, 2004 5:38:00 PM
 
Кам: Абсолютли нот!

Мартин пытается спасти свою харю:

SASKATOON (CP) -- Paul Martin took another shot at the promise-breaking Ontario Liberals on Monday, saying politicians have a duty to plan for the worst.

The comment came during an exchange with high-school students when one teenager asked the prime minister how politicians can be trusted to keep their election promises.

Martin said politicians must plan for economic surprises as they roll out their campaign promises.

"It's not enough to say how you're going to be able to pay for them under the best of circumstances," he said.

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Politics/CanadaVotes/2004/05/31/480619-cp.html

Anger Management





There's a bizarre irony in the fact that a man who isn't even running in the federal election may wind up having the most influence on its outcome.

A new EKOS Research poll concludes Dalton McGuinty's broken promises in vote rich Ontario could be the key determining factor that leads to a minority government in Ottawa June 28th.

When the Premier introduced health care premiums in his first budget, smashing vows of no tax increases, the anger was palpable.

But while voters know they can't do much to punish the provincial Grits, they're taking their fury out on Team Martin. At least 54 percent of those asked admit they're less likely to vote for the Liberals because of McGuinty's pocket picking.

The party still continues to lead the pack nationally with 38 percent of decided voters, while the Conservatives are catching up at 30.4 percent. The N.D.P. are next, with 18 percent, while the Bloc Quebecois uni-provincial support is at 10.7 percent.

But the numbers tell a tale in Ontario, where the Liberals hit the triple digit figure in seats in the last election. While more than half admit they may punish Paul Martin for McGuinty's handiwork, only 32 percent claim to support the party, while another 12 percent agree it won't make any difference.

Adding to the anger: the Premier's admission on Sunday that he gave the Grit boss a head's up about his health care premium plan, which will cost taxpayers up to $900 more annually.


Although he claims not have spent more than 20 seconds talking about the matter, it's clear it's an issue the voters plan to spend much more time on before the final vote rolls around.
While the Grits are publicly expressing confidence they'll win the election, privately many admit they're worried. The angry response they get during their door-to-door sojourns hasn't let up, and many are now conceding off the record they'll be lucky to return with a minority government.

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 10/19/2003
Posts: 16244
Posted on Monday, May 31, 2004 7:05:00 PM
 
http://www.russianexpress.net/details.asp?article=2342&category=72


МАЙКЛ МОСТИН: ПЕРЕМЕНЫ НЕОБХОДИМЫ
5/28/2004, Выпуск № 329

В минувшее воскресенье стартовала избирательная кампания в федеральный парламент Канады.

Особое внимание канадских СМИ вызывает борьба за депутатский мандат в округе Йорк-Центр, где бывшей хоккейной звезде, представителю либералов, 56-летнему Кену Драйдену противостоит консерватор, 30-летний адвокат Майкл Мостин. Предки Майкла Мостина родом из Украины и Польши, сам он - канадец в третьем поколении, родился и вырос в Торонто. В 1999 году Майкл закончил факультет права университета Western Ontario. Неоднократно награждался за отличную учебу и другие достижения. Специализируется в уголовном, семейном и других областях права. Майкл является членом Beth Emeth Bais Yehuda Congregation, BJC, Toronto Jewish Free Loan Cassa. Кроме того, он заядлый спортсмен, играет в хоккейной лиге Bnai Brith на Chesswood Arena, а также владеет черным поясом по таэквандо. Встреча обозревателя Русского Экспресса с Майклом Мостиным состоялась 23 мая, в день начала избирательной кампании, в предвыборном штабе кандидата в депутаты по адресу 535 Wilson Heights Blvd., рядом со станцией метро "Downsview".
РЭ : Почему вы решили заняться политикой, учитывая, что ваша профессиональная карьера развивалась вполне успешно? Ваша семья одобрила ваше намерение баллотироваться на пост депутата парламента?
М.М.: Отвечу вначале на второй вопрос. Моя семья оказывает мне чрезвычайно сильную поддержку, без которой я просто не смог бы вести эффективную избирательную кампанию.
Большинство моих родных живет в Северном Йорке. Моя сестра с мужем, например, несколько лет назад из Северного Йорка выехали, а сейчас сюда возвращаются. Я очень привязан к этому району города. На территории округа Йорк-Центр живу с шести лет, и вернулся сюда после учебы в университете.
Активно в деятельность Консервативной партии я был вовлечен три месяца назад, когда был номинирован кандидатом в депутаты. Почему я решил баллотироваться? Да, я работаю адвокатом, у меня вполне успешная практика, и в политику я пошел не для того, чтобы найти работу. Это решение назревало давно. Мне очень не нравятся многие вещи, которые происходят в моей стране, в моем округе, я не могу с этим мириться. В то же время я чувствую в себе силы, знания, способности добиться перемен к лучшему - и на национальном уровне, и на уровне нашего community. Пора, например, решить давно назревшую проблему с парком Downsview, рядом с которым, как вы видите, находится наш предвыборный офис...
В то же время мой соперник, г-н Драйден, в этом округе не живет, он был сюда десантирован по воле премьер-министра Пола Мартина. В интервью Toronto Star Драйден заявил, что не намерен сюда переезжать даже в случае избрания. Он сказал, что с равным успехом мог бы выдвинуться и в Этобико. По его словам, нет никакой принципиальной разницы между этими округами, просто в них живут разные этнические группы. Я вижу в таком подходе неуважение к избирателям. Это кажется мне антидемократическим. И вряд ли Драйден будет всерьез отстаивать интересы этого округа. Я очень горжусь тем, что был номинирован демократически, что имею поддержку Йорк-Центра, который желает моей победы на выборах.
РЭ : Что в политической платформе Консервативной партии Канады вы считаете наиболее актуальным?
М.М.: Одна из важнейших проблем, которая особо волнует лично меня, решению которой уделено серьезное внимание в платформе Консервативной партии и которая имеет прямое отношение к округу Йорк-Центр - это проблема растущей преступности. В последнее время у нас значительно увеличилось число преступлений, связанных с применением огнестрельного оружия. По-моему, либералы слишком мягко относятся к преступлениям такого рода, они не уважают права жертв преступлений. Как криминальный адвокат, я вижу, какие негативные процессы происходят в этой сфере, в судебной системе и во всем, что с этим связано. И
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Monday, May 31, 2004 9:02:00 PM
 
О чем мы финк, Лепа? Кандидат как кандидат, с предсказуемыми позициями. Я только знаю, что если бы консерваторы нами правили, то наши войска были бы в Ираке плечо к плечу с американскими оккупантами. Если кто-то хочет посылать канадские войска для утверждения империи республиканской партии США, тогда пусть голосуют за консерваторов.

Жалко, зеленые слишком слабы, а то НДП что-то заносит на этих выборах. Они вместо того, чтобы фокусироваться на необходимости развивать инфраструктуру полезли в дебри отмены Clarity Act. От интернационализма к национализму.

Пролетари усих краин, еднайтеся!
Joined: 10/19/2003
Posts: 16244
Posted on Monday, May 31, 2004 9:26:00 PM
 
ben

НДП называют себя социалистами, только вот реальных усилий в борьбе за права рабочих (не шучу - именно так) я что-то не вижу. Нет ничего о борьбе с нелегальной рабочей силой, о технике безопасности и охране труда, и т.д.
Зато идет борьба за отсос голосов среднего класса по темам экологии и здравоохранения, игра на антивоенной теме.
Поэтому они и получат мало голосов.

Да, консерваторы нами на правят, но и либералы, увы - тоже нет. Все идет по воле волн и беспринципности, в том числе в экономике. Страна катится вниз:(
Joined: 8/24/2003
Posts: 778
Posted on Tuesday, June 1, 2004 1:32:00 PM
 
в ответ на топик о голосовании
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Tuesday, June 1, 2004 1:37:00 PM
 
Harper announces tough crime policy

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Politics/CanadaVotes/2004/05/31/480675-cp.html

Edited by - evil raccoon on 6/1/2004 1:37:43 PM
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Tuesday, June 1, 2004 1:41:00 PM
 
..like I was saying.. the only campaigning this guy is doing is attacking others:

Layton takes aim at two more premiers

EDMONTON (CP) - NDP Leader Jack Layton blamed two western premiers Monday for providing the prototype for what he considers Stephen Harper's cost-cutting and privatization agenda.


http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Politics/CanadaVotes/2004/05/31/480550-cp.html

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 7/22/2003
Posts: 6734
Posted on Tuesday, June 1, 2004 2:17:00 PM
 
Приехав из СССР кто-то еще питает социалистические надежды! Браво!

Тноr: скинь мне свой телефон на [email protected]
Оч. нада пагаварыт.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Tuesday, June 1, 2004 4:03:00 PM
 
No plans to change abortion laws: Harper

http://www.cbc.ca/storyview/MSN/2004/06/01/harpabort040601



--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Tuesday, June 1, 2004 5:28:00 PM
 
Приехав из СССР кто-то еще питает социалистические надежды! Браво!

100%
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, June 2, 2004 9:13:00 AM
 
blabla

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 2, 2004 1:41:00 PM
 
Harper said he will scrap the infamous gun-registry
that cost the taxpayers over a billion of $ when it was estimated to cost around $ 78 million.

the money that would go for gun registry, if elected, Harper promised to spend on hiring RCMP or police and getting sex-offender registry in place

Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, June 2, 2004 2:06:00 PM
 
Thor: damn right..

Remember a year ago some pervert-kid rapist was released into a halfway house in High Park? People here were furious. This people should be sent to Nunavunt or some shit.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 2, 2004 3:05:00 PM
 
Stephen just gave a speech in Toronto Trade Board Club in the First Canadian Place. Belinda Stronach was there for occassion.

Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Saturday, June 5, 2004 1:25:00 PM
 
I was just driving down Roncesvalles, saw shitload of people with flags. Then I noticed a NDP bus, I saw Tv cameras and people around Jack Layton. Fuckin Commie in little Poland. So the traffic kinda slow, everybody is rubbernekking, so I open my window and yell "Yous suck, u goddamn commie bastard" Layton looks in my eyes, his moustache jumped higher than his eyebrows. He just stood there looking for a second and then i flipped him off. хихихи
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Saturday, June 5, 2004 1:25:00 PM
 
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
Joined: 1/29/2001
Posts: 9351
Posted on Tuesday, June 8, 2004 12:13:00 AM
 
Here is a little something to you from Michael Mostyn;



mms://216.208.71.37/rtd/mostyn.wmv or alternatively, http://www.torontovka.com/v (at the bottom)

Joined: 10/1/2003
Posts: 6154
Posted on Tuesday, June 8, 2004 9:32:00 AM
 
I open my window and yell "Yous suck, u goddamn commie bastard"

Very nice... Is this we all about?

I do not really see anything funny. You need to learn to be just polite. That is the reason I am unlikely to vote "conservative". They are mostly "Bush" alikes. No much thinking happens in their heads.



Edited by - marx on 6/8/2004 9:41:25 AM
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Tuesday, June 8, 2004 10:40:00 AM
 
marx: this is so sweet, really..

u know why I prefer Bush over Kerry? Because Kerry reminds me of Layton, same babbling clown with no set agenta whatsoever.

Joined: 10/1/2003
Posts: 6154
Posted on Tuesday, June 8, 2004 10:53:00 AM
 
Of course cookin' facts and blunt actions are something easier to do than trying to reach reasonable consensus. When these types of people get together you get mid-East conflict, terrorism, etc, etc. Another millitant who is just on the other side of the barricades.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Tuesday, June 8, 2004 10:53:00 AM
 
Vadim: браво!
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Tuesday, June 8, 2004 10:56:00 AM
 
marx: I cannot agree with you because I am pro Iraqui war, not pro Bush.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Tuesday, June 8, 2004 11:33:00 AM
 
marx,
i know you are an avid proo-peaceful resolvement of conflicts and all, but history has it simple : guns don't kill people, people kill people.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Tuesday, June 8, 2004 11:52:00 AM
 
Si vis pacem para bellum...
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Tuesday, June 8, 2004 12:02:00 PM
 
a poll today (some three-letter named poll) has Conservatives at 34% and Liberals at 32%.
Joined: 10/1/2003
Posts: 6154
Posted on Tuesday, June 8, 2004 1:35:00 PM
 
Here is quite reflective article talking about Reagan about the differences between Democrats and Republicans.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5151912/

Right now we may be seeing something like 80s election in the U.S.

However, let's remember that Reagan's administration brought up Bin Laden. While excessive complexity is a drag, overly simplistic approaches fail. Too bad people have short memory.


Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Tuesday, June 8, 2004 1:39:00 PM
 
marx: Mistakes happen, but who is to say that if Laden wasn't brought up then, there would be something worse at the time. USSR also supported China and North Korea, and right now these countries are more unpredictable than Iraq and Afgan.

Canada sends a lot of aid to different countries in Africa and such. What if a someone in that country becomes the next Castro or Sadam? Can you blame the govenment for that? Could that be forseen?
Joined: 1/2/2004
Posts: 246
Posted on Tuesday, June 8, 2004 2:02:00 PM
 
Иной раз меня поражает наивность людей, особенно напичканых х@йнёй СМИ. Вся политика сейчас посторенна с одной очень простой целью: как задурить публику что бы она нас выбрала, а мы в казну рукой залезем ну и хапнём ну ещё своей денежной "крыше" дадим хапнуть которая нам выборную компанию "спонсировала". Война в Ираке это простейший способ взять бюджетный сурплас (созданый налого-платильщиками) ну и тупо засунуть его себе в карман. Весь военно-промышленный комплекс Штатов просто набивает карманы за жизни людей. Х@й Чейни и ему подобные (не будем прибегать к грубостям) ну и те которые Бушу купили выборы - вот все он и сейчас п$здят казну - EASY FUCKING MONEY.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Tuesday, June 8, 2004 2:32:00 PM
 
marx, and how is it relevant for the upcoming elections ?
i must say electorat has short memory :
Jane Stewart scandal 1 billion dollars, HRDC scandal 1 billion dollars,
gun-registry fiasco instead of estimated 78 million over a billion and still counting, Kyoto that will cost Canadian economy thousands of job and by most modest estimates 20 billion, AdScam 250 million dollars.. how more of Liberal mismanagement do you want ?
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Tuesday, June 8, 2004 2:43:00 PM
 
r
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Tuesday, June 8, 2004 2:45:00 PM
 
r
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Tuesday, June 8, 2004 2:47:00 PM
 
r
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Tuesday, June 8, 2004 3:17:00 PM
 
blabla

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Tuesday, June 8, 2004 3:21:00 PM
 
blabla

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Tuesday, June 8, 2004 8:59:00 PM
 
yeah, I think there is more and more evidence that Muslim terrorism is justified.... Good luck Americans!
Joined: 10/19/2003
Posts: 16244
Posted on Tuesday, June 8, 2004 9:23:00 PM
 
Все-таки америкосы - козлы. Разве ж можно мусульман собакой дразнить?
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 9:05:00 AM
 
leopold: не в мусульманах дело а в бин ладене. да вообще

бен: ага, конечно, и Бергу голову отрезать...

тут собачка насрала, они флаги америкаские жгут, они еще такую прикольную штучку делают - куклу с фоткой Буша, Шарона и так далее и сжигают во время демонстрации..
Joined: 12/21/2001
Posts: 30002
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 9:11:00 AM
 

Ракун, им можно, они дикие, необразованные, а мы цивилизованные, должны им пальчиком погрозить и лишить десерта;) ....хотя Буш, конечно, козел, его семейка, кстати, бизнесс партнер с Бин Ладенами, по телеку передача была, как всегда ночью;) так у них дома (одни из..) рядом;)

Видимо, бабло не поделили, и началась разборка;)


Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 9:19:00 AM
 
mrs: есть всегда 2 политики - открытая и закрытая..

я аж слышал что Буш пренадлежит Скалз или Масонам.. также я читал что Бушы - родственники Британской королевы и бла бла бла.. если такой херне постоянно верить, то вообще рехнутся можно.

Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 1:32:00 PM
 
Песец.. вот народ охуевает в Канаде:

NDP candidate under fire for past comments about Jews

EDMONTON - An NDP candidate in Edmonton is facing allegations of anti-Semitism for comments he posted on the internet 10 years ago.

At the time, Malcolm Azania was part of an e-mail debate about whether Jews were friends or enemies of black people.



http://www.cbc.ca/stories/2004/06/09/canada/newelxnndpcomments040609

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 1:33:00 PM
 
Ракун, да это ж чёрный, какой с него спрос.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 1:34:00 PM
 
я аж слышал что Буш пренадлежит Скалз или Масонам.. также я читал что Бушы - родственники Британской королевы и бла бла бла.. если такой херне постоянно верить, то вообще рехнутся можно.


почитай перед тем как распространяцца на такие sensitive темы.
Буши действительно состоят в секретном обществе Skulls & Bones, но при чём тут масоны ?

на самом деле дед Буша финансировал Гитлера дэцэл.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 1:46:00 PM
 
Тор: лол .. я не критикую что он сказал а что 10 лет прошло, если бы я в политику пошел бы этого форума бы хватило меня в тюрьму посадить

насчет Буша - дурак он а не Скалз энд Бонз.
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 2:18:00 PM
 
"Ракун, да это ж чёрный, какой с него спрос."

Тор, у тебя сегодня послезапойный стресс? Или с тебя тоже спроса нет?
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 3:16:00 PM
 
I am glad conservatives are coming aboard on this issue... Their law and order agenda, however, is certainly at odds with this proposal...

Conservative think-tank says government should cash in on pot revenue

VANCOUVER (CP) - The federal government should decriminalize marijuana and tax the revenue, says a report released Wednesday by the usually conservative Fraser Institute.


Conservative estimates show the government stands to reap an estimated $2 billion in potential revenues annually into its coffers, said Steve Easton, a professor of economics at Simon Fraser University and senior fellow at the think-tank. It's not a question of whether Canadians approve or disapprove of marijuana use, he suggested.


"I think it's like prohibition in the U.S. in that period, in the sense we've tried to suppress (marijuana use)," said Easton.


"We've not been successful in doing so and all we do is create an industry that really gives organized crime a chance to get some revenue."


The benefits of legalizing are that organized crime would be shut out and those harmed by marijuana could get treatment instead of going to jail, Easton argued.


"It seems to me a far better use of our resources is to use those resources to make it legal, tax it in an appropriate way and, to the extent it causes certain kinds of social problems, then we can deal with that as part of the revenue."


The study estimated there are some 17,500 marijuana grow-ops in British Columbia, where Easton said only 13 per cent of offenders are actually charged. His report also found 55 per cent of those convicted receive no jail time.


Easton said some 23 per cent of Canadians have admitted to using the drug.


But Paul Shrive, the head of the B.C. Association of Chiefs of Police, dismissed the idea of taxing marijuana sales.


He said he sees ethical issues with government "making money off the backs of addicted people," although he acknowledged it already benefits from alcohol sales.


In his 39 years in policing, Shrive said he's never met a person addicted to "extreme" drugs who didn't start out with pot.


"I don't think it's going to solve any of the (problems on the) social side," he said.


Prime Minister Paul Martin said last week the Liberals are committed to carrying out their plan to decriminalize marijuana if re-elected.


The government would have to reintroduce a law to hand out fines - not criminal sentences - to people caught with 15 grams of pot or less.


The legislation died last month when Parliament was dissolved for the federal election campaign.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 3:30:00 PM
 
decriminalize it, not monopolize-commercialize it
Joined: 1/30/2003
Posts: 22206
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 3:31:00 PM
 
VANCOUVER (CP) - The federal government should decriminalize marijuana and tax the revenue, says a report released Wednesday by the usually conservative Fraser Institute

God bless conservatives ; )
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 3:37:00 PM
 
well, Stephen Harper should take that into his campaign platform
but then lots of oldtimers would take their votes for him...
touchy subject, more of fathers-sons issue, than politics..

but a nice conservative perspective
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 3:45:00 PM
 
Oh yeah.. make it leagal, pocket the income. Imagine new businesses to spruce in the system. "Kam's Weed delivery" hehehe

Im not smoking it even if its legal though, so I might not be excited as u guys are.
Joined: 1/30/2003
Posts: 22206
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 3:49:00 PM
 
well, Stephen Harper should take that into his campaign platform
but then lots of oldtimers would take their votes for him...
touchy subject, more of fathers-sons issue, than politics..


Taking into consideration that average population age in Canada is above 50... you bet your sweet "comment c'a vas" they're gonna nail Harper's arshe...

Edited by - Kam on 6/9/2004 3:49:20 PM
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 3:50:00 PM
 
you bet your sweet "comment c'a vas"

i see America leaves more imprints on your sorry aRSe ;p
way to go, Dogg !
Joined: 1/30/2003
Posts: 22206
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 3:52:00 PM
 
Conservatives should probably stay out of marijuana issue until they win the election and then just unconditionaly legalize pot right after.

In following six years their approval raiting is gonna recover when the population admits the benefits of marijuana taxation...
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 3:52:00 PM
 
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/1086792343136_82201543/?hub=TopStories

renegate "Tories" (anything but conservative Red Tories) under "leadership" of Joe Clark are supporting Anne McClellan.

Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 3:55:00 PM
 
for sure, but man, one thing i'd hate to happen is legalization of weed cuz government only wants to regulate it with taxes and all.
that's the same scenario with tobacco. major corporations like philipp morris are gonna take over and monopolize the market
screw that. they'll kill the product

however, my optimism comes from the fact that regardless of future on this issue there will be people who appreciate the product enough to grow own dope and share it.
at profitable prices or whatever, i have no problem with that.
my problem is with government's trying to kill the business(as it is common in Canada) by taxing, licensing and the rest of this junk.

so far they've given up on licensing guns due to corruption and mismanaged funds.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 3:58:00 PM
 
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/1078686572191_78?s_name=&no_ads=

degenerate Liberal MP Carolyn Parrish(Mississauga) won a Liberal nomination to represent a new riding Miss-Erindale.

that's the same MP who caused furor over her "moron" remarks last year. a politician that uses dirty tricks like that to get a name recognition should not be elected.

Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 3:58:00 PM
 
THor "lots of oldtimers "

excuse me, but who ARE conservatives? They are 99 per cent old folks... How many younger people, except for Russian immigrants, support the conservatives? And Russians support the cons b/c they are mean, greedy, xenophobic, and mysoginistic.

Joined: 1/30/2003
Posts: 22206
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 4:01:00 PM
 
Dogg, I don't give a ratt's arche about none of that shaize...

I just wanna fulfill my life-long ambition: Open a LEGAL hash-bar!
Joined: 1/30/2003
Posts: 22206
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 4:02:00 PM
 
You can even be a manager if you want to : )
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 4:03:00 PM
 
And Russians support the cons b/c they are mean, greedy, xenophobic, and mysoginistic.

ben, honestly, you think these are the reasons ? stop being such a bigot for crying out loud. it breaks my heart to see this.

how about most of european (eastern & western), asian and other educated immigrants supporting the Conservatives ?

and true, lots of x-soviet immigrants support the Conservatives because they know how it it under a communist dictatorship that leeches of masses and gives nothing back!
Joined: 1/2/2004
Posts: 246
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 4:04:00 PM
 
Даёшь Кретьена назад!!!

ХЕМП ПАУААА!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 4:04:00 PM
 
Kam, hellz yeah !!!

we ll be chilling and smoking and reading nice books, while having intelligent discussions =)
hell, ben can join when he gets his head cleared up ;p
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 4:05:00 PM
 
Thanx but I'm allergic to the smell

ben: u talk and act like a bitter old man, u want Communism - move to China, eat rice for the rest of your life.
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 4:07:00 PM
 
but if Canada is the same communist dictatorship under the Liberal rule (who have been in power for ten years when most of the Russian immigrants came to Canada) as the USSR, then why are the Russian immigrants here? If there is no difference in the results, why are they not going somewhere else, but instead are arriving in big numbers from Israel and the former Soviet republics?

Thor, are you blind or what? Or you want to live in the bloody and primitive world of "Gangs of New York" when there was so little government regulation?
Joined: 1/30/2003
Posts: 22206
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 4:08:00 PM
 
Ben, c'mon. NDP had their chance to show what they're really worth in BC. All they did is they supported bums, unions and lazy-fat-ass-dumb-as-fuck-no-good-at-anything white trash.

They drove the richest province to poverty, unemployment and greatest debt in the Country. Do you think they really have another chance for next 20 years?
Joined: 3/25/2002
Posts: 2486
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 4:09:00 PM
 
ben,
You need to see a head doctor ASAP. You're the best entertainment on this forum. What a dunce. Don't need to go to any circus.
Joined: 1/30/2003
Posts: 22206
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 4:10:00 PM
 
u want Communism - move to China, eat rice for the rest of your life.

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!! : ))) don't forget the chow-main on hollidays : )
Joined: 7/14/2002
Posts: 3304
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 4:12:00 PM
 
I really didn't read the whole thred so may be this was asked and answered in any case those are the questions:
1. would the conservatives change the taxation policy - e.g. will the provincial taxes be reduced increased or will not change if the conservatives win?
2.how would conservative party deal with the insurance problem? It is a real pain in the butt! A lot of people paying 4000-6000 CDN yearly. So will the conservatives try to change the situation.
3. medicine- I know that in Alberta people are paying some sort of medicare insurance and that there are private medical institutions while in Ontario we pay taxes and not medical insurance fee and enjoy all the beauty of the "free" medicine. I wonder how the conservatives would handle this problem?
I also wonder if the immigration issues are regulated majorily on the provincial or federal level.

Joined: 1/30/2003
Posts: 22206
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 4:14:00 PM
 
Also Ben, when was the last time you've actually been to Russia? Just so you'd know things have gone through a long fucking way of changes there. This includes the mentality too, as opposed to that of "jewish wave" which came here 20-10 years ago...

Edited by - Kam on 6/9/2004 4:16:44 PM
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 4:15:00 PM
 
Hobbit: in regards to medical.. Ontario gov't ie Daltonik MacGuilty already made us all pay at least 30$ a month for medical care.
Joined: 7/14/2002
Posts: 3304
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 4:18:00 PM
 
Evil - how comes?
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 4:21:00 PM
 
Дюдъ - читать форум надо.. мы сейчас каждый должны платить 30-90$ за хелс кейр
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 4:28:00 PM
 
Hobbit

all the issues you mentioned, except immigration, are in the provincial jurisdiction, whereas immigration is the joint jurisdiction. Of course, the federal gov't does not legislate with respect to provincial taxes.

As for taxes, the feds should just reduce the federal taxes and allow the provinces to increase theirs without changing the overall tax burden.

The tax burden in Ontario is not particularly heavy. I am in the highest tax bracket and I am just paying one third of my income in taxes (which is very reasonable).
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 4:29:00 PM
 
I hate this bracket shit.. should be 20% for everyone
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 4:35:00 PM
 
Ракун, процитирую классику

"у них денег куры не клюют, а у нас на водку не хватает"...

какое тут равенство? Я больше получаю от нашей системы, поэтому должен платить пропорционально больше. Мне не жалко.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 4:37:00 PM
 
я посмотрю как тебе не жалко когда наконецто наберется достаточно идиотов которые вымерут НДП и у тебя будут забирать намного больше
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 4:39:00 PM
 
ben, прям как в школе, у мя писька больше =) хау кьют =)
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 4:39:00 PM
 
Но вопрос, не только сколько забирают, но и на что тратят. Вот в чем вопрос. Я поддерживают НДП имменно из-за того, что остальные партии не уделяют достаточно внимания главным для меня приоритетам: окружающей среде и здравоохранению.
Joined: 11/4/2003
Posts: 16663
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 4:42:00 PM
 
а мне вот жалко :) потому как я, видимо, капиталист :)
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 4:47:00 PM
 
вот именно, бен.. может поделишся с нами тоже зарплатой своей. Я обещаю хорошо буду тратить твои бабки.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 4:54:00 PM
 
http://www.taxtips.ca/tax_rates.htm

впт сколько с нас сдирают
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 9, 2004 4:54:00 PM
 
another good web site

http://www.taxpayer.com/
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Friday, June 11, 2004 9:38:00 AM
 
another good website http://www.teammartinsaid.ca

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 10/1/2003
Posts: 6154
Posted on Saturday, June 12, 2004 1:49:00 AM
 
Если честно то задалбали вы со своими таксами.
Расплатитесь с долгами побыстрее и освободятся деньги
и на социальные программы и на сокрашение таксов.

Пару лет наза я сравнивал процент который уходит на оплату необходимого здесь и в Штатах. То что платится в штатах отдельно а в канаде оплачиваеся из налогов я считал как налог. Расход это расход. В результате разница составила
2-3%, что никого не спасёт. Единственно на ком это сушественно отражается если зарплата (доход) очень и очень высокая. Однако господа из последней категории находят альтернативные пути сокращения налогов. Такое чувство что наиболее рьяные защитники здесь просто за большую и светлую идею. Сплошные иделисты. Прямо как марксисты. :))))


ПС: Знакомые в Штатах платили $250К за 2 операции. Частную страховку уже было не купить. В семье были деньги заплатить.
Господа демагоги, человек со средней зарплатой такое даже в Штатах позволит не может. Да и многих есть нормальная critical illness & disability insurance? Для самого человека эта страховка намного важнее чем life insurance. Поэтому и стоит она много дороже.

С Европой канадские налоги сравните. Сразу будет чему порадоваться. :)

Joined: 6/12/2004
Posts: 3
Posted on Saturday, June 12, 2004 10:45:00 AM
 
marx

Ты почитай топик сначало, прежде чем умничать. Дело не в таксах, а как политики их тратят.
Joined: 2/2/2003
Posts: 4194
Posted on Saturday, June 12, 2004 11:10:00 AM
 
"Расплатитесь с долгами побыстрее и освободятся деньги
и на социальные программы и на сокрашение таксов." - это всё или ещё какие-нить пожелания?....лол....
Joined: 6/12/2004
Posts: 1
Posted on Saturday, June 12, 2004 12:14:00 PM
 
mein bin shiite: хаха.. размечтались!
Joined: 10/1/2003
Posts: 6154
Posted on Saturday, June 12, 2004 12:24:00 PM
 
MBS: вместо того что бы платить проценты эти деньги лучше исползовать на что то конкретное. Любой кредит адвайзер посоветует это.

Вентилятор так о том и говорим! Мне к примеру не нравится постоянные корректировки в программу консерваторов. Они все время что то добавляют и убирают. Сами незнают чего хотят и значит неготовы к правлению. Просматривается явный популизм.

Так же не нравится их идея что любое сокрашение корпоративных таксов будет сопровождаться урезанием федералных программ на развитие бизнеса. В результате
каждый получит по куску но этот кусок настолько мал что не в какие перспективные программы эти деньги вкладыватся не будут, а федеральных программах на это денег уже не будет.
Результат? Скатимся в каменный век.

Готта то сии биг пикчэ! Have a nice weekend!
Joined: 12/13/2003
Posts: 166
Posted on Saturday, June 12, 2004 12:34:00 PM
 
согласен с марксом.где-то до 100-120 в год усредненный налог получается где-то 32-35%. В штате Н-Й у меня при 60 в год было около 35%. Тут охип - там каждый емплоер платит отдельно за тебя как правило если ето не совсем маленькая компания и ты платишь сам.
здес самое противное ето 15% GST+PST. В NY 7% во флориде и делаваре 0%. доплачиват 15% от всего что покупаешь ето пиздец но ни одна партия етого не отменит.
Joined: 10/19/2003
Posts: 16244
Posted on Saturday, June 12, 2004 12:46:00 PM
 
Маркс

А что это за программы развития бизнеса? Где про них почитать можно? Это Хай-тех? Или что-то экспортно-ориентированное для создания рабочих мест для квалифицированных людей? Или, что скорее - это программы для мелкого бизнеса, которые получат людишки по нацсекторам и создадут кучу пекарен с
7баксоввчассреднейзарплатой.

А если так - отбать все бизнесу, срезав налоги - стало быть, консерваторы - рулез.
Joined: 6/12/2004
Posts: 3
Posted on Saturday, June 12, 2004 12:49:00 PM
 
marx

не нравится - не голосуй, в чём проблема?
Joined: 4/30/2004
Posts: 309
Posted on Monday, June 14, 2004 12:35:00 PM
 
Canadian governments tax the biggest segment of the population to the point of nausea, where at least $250,000,000 is frittered away to a bunch of useless shits who render only the service of lying, in a system where the population has two choices on election day: (a) SHIT (b) SHIT, THE SECOND..................to quote John Lennon from the very earliest days of the Beatles: "Bollocks! It's all fuckin' DICK!"
Joined: 7/20/2002
Posts: 8282
Posted on Monday, June 14, 2004 1:24:00 PM
 
Голосуйте за The Absolutely Absurd Party of Canada (http://www.absolutelyabsurdparty.ca/) Каждому проголосовавшему 6 пак бесплатно.:)
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Tuesday, June 15, 2004 12:29:00 PM
 
Eyes right to Harper

blabla

IT'S ALL about Stephen. Paul Martin stepped on to the set of the French-language leaders debate last night with a large target on his forehead, the object of everyone's ire in a three-man punch-out of the Liberal prime minister.

But in homes across Quebec, it's a safe bet voters' eyes were equally focused on the guy with the (thankfully) new hairdo, Conservative Leader Stephen Harper.

Until a month ago, Quebecers had little interest in Harper or the Conservatives, their chances of winning a seat in that province or forming a national government having been rated as roughly equal -- that is, roughly zero.

Now that polls are showing Harper could become prime minister, Quebecers are at least taking notice.

ANTI-GRIT SENTIMENT

"What is certain in Quebec is people really don't want to vote for the Liberals," says Sun Media's pollster, Jean-Marc Leger, noting a phenomenon rampant in most parts of the country.


Outside Quebec, that antagonism towards the Grits has been translating into increased support for Harper and the Tories.

Inside Quebec, anti-Liberal sentiment has given the separatist Bloc Quebecois a ticket back from the walking dead barely four months ago.

Leger says his polls predict if an election were held today, the Bloc could win 51 of the province's 75 seats.

If those numbers held until election day, Martin would be lucky to form a minority government, much less a majority.

But the pollster cautions that much of the Bloc support is soft or undecided, his pre-debate polls showing 45% could change their minds by election day.

"We don't know what will happen to all the people who don't want to vote Liberal," says Leger.

"At the same time, they don't want to give a mandate to the separatist party."

Eyes right to Harper.

While no one is predicting the Tories could win more than a couple of seats in Quebec, Leger says the party could do a lot of damage to the Bloc possibly to the point of helping the Liberals.

It explains just about everything that happened in last night's debate.

The leaders were barely at their microphones when Martin began tossing dirt at Harper in a kind of live imitation of the ridiculous Liberal attack ads.

"Mr. Harper's party is against bilingualism, against regional development, against the right of women to choose, against Kyoto ..."

Throughout the debate, Martin kept returning to Harper, trying to paint the Tory leader as The Really Big Scare.

"Mr. Harper will either have to make drastic cuts to services or go back to a deficit ... It's a black hole," Martin intoned harshly.

Bloc Leader Gilles Duceppe's attacks left no doubt that he is now fighting the election in Quebec on two fronts -- against both the Liberals and Conservatives.

Similarly, New Democratic Party Leader Jack Layton, whose party has no chance of winning seats in Quebec, performed his expected role as the smiling attack dog, going after the Grits and Tories equally.

PERPETUAL COOL

Throughout it all, Harper remained in what has become an apparent state of perpetual cool.

"How can you sit there and talk about numbers?" Harper shot back at Martin with a disarming calm.

Harper then took dead aim at Martin's own mammoth spending promises, and the Liberal government's record of sleaze and squander.

"To suggest you could spend twice or three times what economic growth would allow -- that's what leads to scandals, to incompetence, to wastefulness," Harper said almost dismissively.

While Martin generally stood his ground with confidence and delivered no end of withering attacks, it is doubtful his performance will sign
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Tuesday, June 15, 2004 12:33:00 PM
 
Conservatives leading in pretty much all provinces,

YEAH~!
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Tuesday, June 15, 2004 12:34:00 PM
 
For a bit there I was worried that Harper was a bit too quiet, but he started showing the leadership and strategy I saw in the beginning of the campaign.

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 3/25/2002
Posts: 2486
Posted on Tuesday, June 15, 2004 12:48:00 PM
 
It's all part of a great conservative strategy, gentlemen. It's time to rock and roll.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Tuesday, June 15, 2004 12:51:00 PM
 
Lay low for a bit, let the Liberas embarras themselves and the attack? It works..
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Tuesday, June 15, 2004 12:52:00 PM
 
it ain't that simple as you put it down, but close enough.

p.s. Liberals are definitely not getting a 4th blank cheque this time
Joined: 11/29/2001
Posts: 19958
Posted on Tuesday, June 15, 2004 1:16:00 PM
 
Скоро уже проголосую за Josef Volpe в моем избирательном округе :)))
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Tuesday, June 15, 2004 1:29:00 PM
 
приколы ? or a vote well wasted ? =))
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Tuesday, June 15, 2004 1:33:00 PM
 
off topic: Thor: do you have a direct email? I have something I need someone to proof read, coz its very important, and I kinda need it back within the hafanawa.. can i send u that?
Joined: 11/29/2001
Posts: 19958
Posted on Tuesday, June 15, 2004 1:34:00 PM
 
В нашем округе wasted только голоса за консервантов :))
Joined: 8/2/2001
Posts: 3146
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 1:24:00 AM
 
This will be the most interesting election... GO HARPER!
Joined: 10/1/2003
Posts: 6154
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 6:37:00 AM
 
I doubt it will be the most interesting election but it will be close.

No one really was a clear winner of the debates. Jack was the most outgooing there, but way too much talking and to the level of interupting others. Due to way to many attacks Martin was too much on defensive and did not communicate his view too well and clear. I think, he failed to expand (even briefly) on some major points whoich could make things more clear for an average folk make a kill. This made Harper look like more cool type of guy.

I find it quite alarming that neither Harper nor Layton are paying attention the reduction of the national debt. This means that nether Conservative government nor minority government will give it enough attention. With shrinking tax payer base due to aging of population and aging infrastructure which was built up in 60-80s, you folks are faced with servicing the debt and supporting the need for growing repairs. Where are you going to get the money???

It is a shame younger people have no clue or understanding of it! It is an archi-important issue!


Edited by - marx on 6/16/2004 6:41:15 AM
Joined: 11/6/2003
Posts: 143
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 8:52:00 AM
 
This is rather long winded but I have to pass it on.



] I received this from a friend of a friend. It is worth a
]read when you get a few minutes - and before the election -don't forget to
]vote!!
]
] Hello.
]
]My name is Alan Robberstad
]I am a Canadian.
]One voter out of millions of Canadian voters.
]
]Paul Martin is no friend of mine.
]Liberal governments have not made my life any better.
]Liberal governments have made the future worse for my
]children.
]
]Jean Chretien and the Liberal Party became Prime
]Minister many years ago.
]Guess who was the Liberal Finance Minister.....Paul
]Martin...LEST WEFORGET
]
] Since 1993:
] (1) My taxes have increased.
] (2) My family's share of the national debt has increased.
] (3) My personal expenses have increased.
] (4) My waiting time to see a doctor has increased.
] (5) My concerns for my family's safety have increased.
] (6) My costs to educate my children have increased.
] (7) Government interference in my life has increased.
] (8) My personal debt has increased.
] (9) My income has stayed more or less the same.
] (10) My savings have decreased.
] (11) The buying power of my dollar, in Canada, has decreased.
] (12) The value of my dollar, in the U.S., has decreased.
] (13) My trust of elected officials has decreased.
] (14) My trust in the justice system has decreased.
] (15 )My trust in the immigration system has decreased.
] (16) My hope that a Liberal won't waste my tax dollars has decreased.
] (17 )My dreams for a better future for my kids, in Canada, have
]disappeared.
]
]That is my story since the Liberals came to power.
]
]I am not voting for Paul Martin's Liberals.
]I am voting against Paul Martin and his Liberal Party on June 28, 2004.
]
]I am voting for Stephen Harper and the Conservative Party.
]
]Do I like the Conservatives?
]Not particularly......I don't really like Politics.
]I am not political by nature.
]I am not passionate about politics.
]I am a middle age guy (48).
]I live in a small house on a fairly quiet street in Edmonton.
]I have a wife, Kathy, and two children (ages 19 and 17).
]I have no pets.
]I am a middle class man.
]I don't usually say too much.
]
]Until now.
]
]Now I am going to say something!
]
]In 35 of the past 37 years, Canada has been ruled by:
] (1) Pierre Trudeau - a multi-millionaire lawyer from Quebec.
] (2) Brian Mulroney - a multi-millionaire lawyer from Quebec.
] (3) Jean Chretien - a multi-millionaire lawyer from Quebec.
] (4) And now we are going to vote for Paul Martin???? - a
] multi-millionaire lawyer from Quebec???
]
]The leader of the Conservative party, Stephen Harper, is:
] (1) Not a lawyer.
] (2) Not a multi-millionaire.
] (3) Not from Quebec.
]
]Stephen Harper says that the Conservative party will:
] (1) Reduce my taxes.
] (2) Pay off the national debt as fast as they can.
] (3) Shrink the size and influence of the federal government.
]
]That's good enough for me.
]I'm going to give the Conservative party a chance with my vote.
]
]But wait!
]Paul Martinis now saying the same thing.
]My mother told me forty years ago:
]"Fool me once - shame on you.
]Fool me twice - shame on me!"
]
]The Liberals have had 34 years to be financially responsible.
]Remember, Jean Chretien was Trudeau's Finance Minister.
]Remember also, Paul
Joined: 10/1/2003
Posts: 6154
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 9:32:00 AM
 

] (1) My taxes have increased.
] (2) My family's share of the national debt has increased.
] (3) My personal expenses have increased.
] (4) My waiting time to see a doctor has increased.
] (5) My concerns for my family's safety have increased.
] (6) My costs to educate my children have increased.
] (7) Government interference in my life has increased.
] (8) My personal debt has increased.
] (9) My income has stayed more or less the same.
] (10) My savings have decreased.
] (11) The buying power of my dollar, in Canada, has decreased.
] (12) The value of my dollar, in the U.S., has decreased.
] (13) My trust of elected officials has decreased.
] (14) My trust in the justice system has decreased.
] (15 )My trust in the immigration system has decreased.
] (16) My hope that a Liberal won't waste my tax dollars has decreased.
] (17 )My dreams for a better future for my kids, in Canada, have
]disappeared.


Ouch! Let's not to post at least the obvious nonsense! The above statements as most of the post is just a bullshit, which does not say much of good about the person who re-posted this here. At least not much about their maturity.


Joined: 7/22/2003
Posts: 6734
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 9:32:00 AM
 
А что это все так резко на инглиш перешли?
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 10:51:00 AM
 
mrax: u have a problem with truth?

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 11/29/2001
Posts: 19958
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 10:53:00 AM
 
Господи, какой был базар-вокзал вчера на дебатах!
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 11:12:00 AM
 
а мя Жиль Дусэп порадовал
вот это политик.
Joined: 11/29/2001
Posts: 19958
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 11:14:00 AM
 
да он только языком цокал, два слова по-англицки связать не может.
мне кстати, джек лэйтон, нравится :)) симпатичный мужик
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 11:16:00 AM
 
да ну, лэйтон лыбицца как олигофрен на партийном заседании
не зря его журналюги smiling jack прозвали
smiling dog =))

а дюсэп оч хорошо представляет свою провинцию.
неплохой лидер, принципиальный.

А Харпер порадовал. Харизматичен, умён, сдержан, уверен, молодца =)
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 11:36:00 AM
 
Тор,

Харпер харизматичен???? Типичный зануда без искры какой-либо.

Хотя должен признать, что он держался молодцом на дебатах. Он не дал втянуть себя в какие-либо дискуссии по существу, так что всякие ред неки из Эдмонтона и жлобы из Торонто могут спокойно за него голосовать.
Joined: 11/4/2003
Posts: 16663
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 11:36:00 AM
 
русь, ток не гри, что ты в натуре смарела это :)?
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 11:38:00 AM
 
какой зануда, о чём ты.
говорил уверенно, не вчитывался в записки как Лейтон,
отвечал по пунктам, не отходил от сути.

п.с. к тому же он более интеллектуал чем оратор. но молодец,
за последнее время подтянулся как публичная фигура.

Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 11:41:00 AM
 
бен, зачем же глупые оскорбления ?
Joined: 7/22/2003
Posts: 6734
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 11:47:00 AM
 
бен:
Браво, типично социалистическая философия: "кто не с нами, тот против нас!"
и ..."если враг не сдается, его уничтожают" (И. В. Сталин (Джугашвили))

Всех к стенке, кулаков раскулачить, консерваторов расконсервировать, а зеленые сами покраснеют, когда созреют!

Все голосуют за симпатягу Джека!
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 11:51:00 AM
 
а ведь лэйтона всерьёз было трудно воспринимать,
особенно с его постоянной улыбкой блаженного ;п
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 11:59:00 AM
 
Надо воспринимать всерьез и Жуля и Лейтона - они будут решать, какое у нас будет правительство. Уже ясно, что у нас будет коалиция впервые с тех пор, как Кларк был премьером (если я не ошибаюсь). Либералы и Консерваторы не набирают даже близко к большинству.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 11:59:00 AM
 
ответь на вопрос, это мы и сами сечём.
Joined: 11/29/2001
Posts: 19958
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 12:04:00 PM
 
Да никто не был молодцом. Все, как собаки, накинулись на Мартина, как-будто народ и без того не знает про него ничего. А вот Харпер мог кое-какие неясности про себя прояснить, но так и остался темной лошадкой.
Joined: 7/22/2003
Posts: 6734
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 12:13:00 PM
 
Нет, ребята, хорошо, что я эту лабуду не смотрел (ну разве только в рекламных паузах), а еще лучше, что не пришлось пропустить Лейкерс-Пистонс.
Поршни Озерникам таки задвинули!
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 12:20:00 PM
 
Рус, дык,у Мартина наглости хватает лезьти в выборы.
Хороший политик (oxymoron)просто не выставлял бы своей кандидатиры. Лавров политики ему захотелось. Жил бы себе припеваючи, управлял Canada Steamship Lines и не горевал.
ну по-крайней мере пришёл на след. выборах и вытащил бы разбитую Либ партию куда-то
а ща только ухудшение ситуации
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 12:22:00 PM
 
Joined: 7/20/2002
Posts: 8934
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 12:55:00 PM
 
дебаты не смотрел, но лэйтон молодец по-любому
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 12:55:00 PM
 
почему ?
Joined: 7/20/2002
Posts: 8934
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 12:57:00 PM
 
читать умеешь?

по-любому!
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 12:59:00 PM
 
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
Joined: 7/22/2002
Posts: 3641
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 1:01:00 PM
 
Тор, а дырка в 50 миллиардов в бюджете консерваторов тебя не останавливает? А расходы, на милитаризацию за счет тех же расходов на медицину? И тоже еще интересно где он собирается брать деньги, если он еще и налоги снижать собрался? Публикация в амереканской газете тоже честной такой была по отношению к Канаде вцелом.
Joined: 10/1/2003
Posts: 6154
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 1:17:00 PM
 
Stubborn, there is nothing here that can stop people who do not realy care or want to analyze specifics of the party's program and think how it is going to affect people. There are very few thoughtful post talking about conservative's program and values and the advantages for the coutry to elect them.

You are a fan of Maple Leafs because it is your home team. You will stick with them no matter how they play! The same here... people just like to think of themselves as Conservatives and everything their leaders do is good and smart. Everything opponents do is either evil or never good enough.

This is an axiom!



Edited by - marx on 6/16/2004 1:20:49 PM
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 1:17:00 PM
 
ну если ты не знаешь где найти деньги на милитаризацию
страны, то стратегам и экономисту Харперу подавно неизвестно.

п.с. про какую американскую статью ты говоришь ?
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 1:19:00 PM
 
marx, перестань чушь нести и не надо дешёвых примеров с ТМЛ.
тебе б во Францию в арабский квартал послушать лекции доморощенных коммунистов-террористов, затем на Соловки,
тогда б коммунизм вмиг перестал быть таким "справедливым и романтичным." вроде большой мальчик, а в ерунду какую-то верит.

Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 1:22:00 PM
 
The same here... people just like to think of themselves as Conservatives and everything their leaders do is good and smart. Everything opponents do is either evil or never good enough.

I bet style of your argument doesn't lack any clairvoyance and complexity. Alas, life must be in shades of two colors.
I'm surprised you haven't written "bad" instead of evil, but then
it had to exaggerate the evil of the right.

Joined: 10/1/2003
Posts: 6154
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 1:32:00 PM
 
Thor моя позиция с коммунизмом ничего обшего не имеет. Тоже самое могно сказать о платформе либералов.

Коммунизм абсолютно безперспективное напрвление и я уже об этом говорил несколько раз. Может вас просто их красная символика раздражает?

То что я высказал имеет очень прагматичные цели. Лучше выплатить значительную часть долгов раньше чем когда
количество пенсионеров резко возрастет а работающих резко уменшиться. При таких долгах налоги еше как подскочат т.к. будет меньше налогоплателшиков. Я пока неуслышал ни от тебя ни от других консерваторов как решать эти проблемы с их программой.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 1:40:00 PM
 
marx: u told me that u decided to back the Grits because you fact that there are too many of us who are backing the Tories. So aren't you just sticking to your guns as a principle and not because you actually believe in them?

Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 1:49:00 PM
 
Робин Гуд был национальный герой - комуннист вор и так далее.. иди разберись был он хороший или плохой
Joined: 10/1/2003
Posts: 6154
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 1:51:00 PM
 
ER, I never said this. Well.... If I wrote something like this, it was clear sarcasm. I do not take sides like this.
Joined: 7/22/2002
Posts: 3641
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 1:51:00 PM
 
Об этом и шла речь - консерваторы хотят вложить деньги в military, снизить налоги, но откуда же появятся эти деньги?

Статья, в которой Харпер опубликовал извинение Канады за то, что она не вступила в войну с Ираком (ты вообще дебаты слушал?)
Joined: 9/10/2002
Posts: 7576
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 2:00:00 PM
 
по-мне, пенсионеры пока что могут идти в попу. В конце концов именно они виноваты в том что они жили припеваючи за счёт своих детей.

Я считаю что дефицит надо выплачивать, но не как можно быстрее, а как можно более рационально. То есть я против того чтобы сейчас затянуть потуже ремни и выплатить дефицит для того чтобы baby-boomers спокойно могли пойти на пенсию в назначенный срок и жить без особых проблем за счёт своих детей.

Нет, я считаю что их (baby-boomers) нужно заставить немного попотеть перед пенсией чтобы они могли САМИ выплатить бОльшую часть своего долга. Как это сделать? Ну хотя бы за счёт того чтобы они пока не могли бы расчитывать на адекватную по нынешнем временам государственную пенсию пока мы выплачевыем их долг. То есть им придёться ещё поработать с десяток лет.

Тем временем мы можем использовать деньги, которые бы вместо этого шли на сверхурочное погашение долга, на то чтобы:
- привлечь международный и местный бизнесс на дополнительные капиталовложения за счёт более конкурентного налогооблажения.
- подтянуть возможности армии для того чтобы мы могли продолжать помогать странам с проблемами и тем самым повышать престижь Канады и тем самым открывать новые рынки для наших фирм
- улучшить здравоохрание которое ухудшилось за последнии десяток лет потому что федеральные деньги урезали с сваливали проблемы на провинциальные бюджеты
- заморозить повыешение налогов

Мать вашу за ногу, в этом году Tax Freedom Day будет 28 июня! Мля, я не хочу полгода пахать на оплату налогов чтобы платить долги baby-boomers и спонсировать бюрократию и их друзей по country-clubs.
Joined: 11/6/2003
Posts: 143
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 2:11:00 PM
 
The above statements as most of the post is just a bullshit, which does not say much of good about the person who re-posted this here. At least not much about their maturity.

Марх
эй ты, интелегент.
Есть проблемы на счет репостинга? Я в рот тебя имел.
Если ты считаеш себя умным то мог бы проигнорировать.
А раз ты развонялся, отсюда следует, что очки тебе интелегентности не прибавляют. Ах, какая жалость.

Приветов тебе :-)
Joined: 11/29/2001
Posts: 19958
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 2:13:00 PM
 
Да не понизят они налоги. Че как дурачки то ведетесь :)
Joined: 7/22/2002
Posts: 3641
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 2:23:00 PM
 
В том-то и дело, что "повестись" сложновато.:) Интересно просто как это Тор видит, потому как так рьяно защищает эту партию.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 2:32:00 PM
 
некоторые обещали их не повышать
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 2:40:00 PM
 
Stubborn,
если ты забыла о Киотском Протоколе, на который ссылаюцца Либералы и БК в своих рекламах превыборных кампаний, который стоит канадской экономике по самым скромным $20 миллиардов за последущие 8-10 лет.
Упразднив этот фарс-договор, мы имеем больше работ и соотвественно больше денег, даже со СНИЖЕННЫХ налогов.

один из примеров.
http://www.torontovka.com/forumNew/Topic.asp?topic_id=6824&forum_id=7&Topic_Title=KYOTO%20ACCORD&forum_title=Interests
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 2:42:00 PM
 
упраздняя (или заменяя на более эффективную) фед.программу по регистрированию оружий (gun-registry) имеем опять же финансы в фед. бюджете.

это те программы, которые срочно нужно вырубить. needless to add those programs were brought in by the Libs.
Joined: 10/1/2003
Posts: 6154
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 3:28:00 PM
 
Just a couple of quick comments....

Stubborn: I did watch the debate.

Pat: People will start retiring in 10 years no matter what.
I do not know how you can keep them working beyond their productive age.

Thor: Kyoto is not bad. Again look into the future. Cheap jobs
will go no matter what. Technological know how will keep Canada strong. In few years the entire world will look up to us and use and license our know-how. The world will be forced to do someting about environment the same way they had to reduce used of coal and build up cleaning systems, etc. It is in the same hight tech category as launching space shuttles. Use the opportunity to make the gap ahead of the U.S. while Mr. Bush and his oil cronies are in office. They will jump on Kyoto bandwagon pretty soon.

Well is's already longer than I hoped for...



Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 3:30:00 PM
 
маркс,
сорри, но бред сивой кобылы, что ты тычешь бестолковыми попсовыми лозунгами либеральных пиаров ? разберись что к чему сначала.

почитай сцылку на топик Kyoto Accord.
Joined: 10/1/2003
Posts: 6154
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 3:55:00 PM
 
I'll read.

I have no idea about liberal propaganda. If it exists it is NOT functioning well! Actually very poorely! Martin missed to clarify in simple terms many of the things and thus he failed in the yesterday's debate. Chretien was much better at it and poll
resuts are the proof. Martin may have good ideas but he does
not see to communicate it well in popular way.

All the mess he allowed in the party during leadershiup change
made things even worse. This is was something conservatives
were suffering from and liberals allowed the same in their ranks
and thus lost votes.
Joined: 10/1/2003
Posts: 6154
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 3:57:00 PM
 
маркс,
сорри, но бред сивой кобылы, что ты тычешь
------------------------

Do not just dismiss... PROVE!
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 3:59:00 PM
 
Joined: 10/19/2003
Posts: 16244
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 4:07:00 PM
 
PAtMunic

А как ты представляешь "поработать" лишние 10 лет? Кто -то их (нас:):)) возьмет в 55 лет на работу? Или это после 65 лет? Я на тебя бы посмотреть хотел в этом возрасте. (Очень бы хотел!!!:):):)На такой работе не то что на пенсию заработать. Опустись на землю.
Joined: 9/10/2002
Posts: 7576
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 4:08:00 PM
 
marx, people will not start retiring no matter what if they don't have money to live the way they thought they could in their "golden years". If the pension is not adequate they will rather keep working, and many many baby-boomers will actually do this exact thing. Because earlier they borrowed money from their kids (through runnning deficit) to live nicely, and because many have failed to start (20-30 years ago) saving independently for their retirement.
Joined: 12/26/2002
Posts: 281
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 6:39:00 PM
 
Люди, да чё вы так спорите? У всех свои мнения и вряд ли вы сможите кого-либо здесь переубедить своими доводами. Идиоты проголосуют за воров (либералов), люмпены и негры за социалистов, хиппи за зелёных а оставшаяся треть страны за консерваторов. Каждому своё.



Joined: 12/21/2001
Posts: 30002
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 6:54:00 PM
 

Либералов надо топить в Онтарио. Они блядь, проперти таксы на апартмент билдинги в этом году так задрали, что ваши лендлорды будут задирать рент, а вы рыдать горькими слезами...

Joined: 12/21/2001
Posts: 30002
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 6:55:00 PM
 

Один с сошкой, а семеро с ложкой. Либералы Мидл класс уничтожают на корню.



Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 7:08:00 PM
 
WOW!!!

ко мне сейчас постучались в дверь, я открыватю, там мой окружной МП короче поздоровался, попиздел со мной, поулыбался, и подошел ко мне чувак вообщем репортер из "Стар" и говорит, мол какие есть ишуз, я ему душу излил, короче он сказал в Субботу в Стар, не помню в каком секшене будет Я

--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 7:24:00 PM
 
Нет, мрс, мы, домовладельцы, должны одни платить налоги на недвижимость, при этом не получая никакого дохода от собственности. Так что правильно, что подняли... А что касается платы за жилье для жильцов - так не включайте добавленный налог в рент, а уменьшите свою прибыль... Так нет - не сделаете... И интересно сколько процентов от стоимости дома вы платите? КОнечно, меньше чем мы... И при этом можете все расходы списывать...

Edited by - ben on 6/16/2004 7:24:38 PM
Joined: 10/1/2003
Posts: 6154
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 7:52:00 PM
 
какая связь между либералами и налогами на недвиживмость?
я вааще думал что налоги на недвижимость это муниципальная юрисдикция. ах я дурак, дурак неграмотный... :P

Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 7:57:00 PM
 
Чтобы что-то было в муниципальной юрисдикции провинциальное правительство должно законодательно это закрепить. До сего года муниципалитет мог повышать только налоги на residential homeowners, а налоги на коммерческих владельцев были заморожены и зафиксированы на более низком уровне. Но в этом году провинциальное правительство разрешило муниципалитетам поднимать в установленных рамках.
Joined: 10/1/2003
Posts: 6154
Posted on Wednesday, June 16, 2004 8:43:00 PM
 
Thanks Ben... I have not thought about this.

Неважно урежут налоги или не урежут. Если урежут то потери восполнят через платные услуги за необходимые вещи или перераспределят по другому.

Политика это наука о перераспределении.

Edited by - marx on 6/16/2004 8:46:07 PM
Joined: 7/22/2002
Posts: 3641
Posted on Thursday, June 17, 2004 8:07:00 AM
 
Тор, извини, но не было времени на чтение всего топика про Киото.

Я конечно уважаю твое мнение, но, как мне кажется, рассуждения, типа "давайте заберем деньги из бюджета, рассчитанные на улучшение окружающей среды и отдадим их на вооружение" равносильны мнению "после меня - хоть потоп!" Я не говорю и о том, что у Канады, вобщем-то, давно сложилась политика и имидж миротворческой страны.

Но, опять же, у каждого свое мнение.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, June 17, 2004 9:04:00 AM
 
Stubborn: how about the money from the gun registry program?
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Thursday, June 17, 2004 9:56:00 AM
 
Ивил Ракун

я не сторонник registry, так как не думаю, что оно что-то особенно привносит в gun control. Просто надо всем было запретить иметь оружие и все. А если хочешь сравнить нашу криминогенную обстановку со страной, где контроль за оружием во много раз слабее, возьми Штаты. И это при том, что 80 процентов преступлений с применением оружия в Канаде совершается с оружием, привезенным контрабандой из США. Так что очевидно уровень преступности у нас был бы еще ниже, если бы рядом не было бы страны с неконтролируемым оружием.

Я конечно понимаю, что в Израиловке тебе дали побряцать оружием, и тебя к нему тянет, но Канада не Израиль, слава тебе господи (хоть его и нет)...

Joined: 7/22/2002
Posts: 3641
Posted on Thursday, June 17, 2004 10:06:00 AM
 
Честно говоря, подобное применение данных средств меня тоже не сильно радует (В принципе, gun registry также немало помогало и помогает полиции. Откуда же они впоследствии будут черпать эту информацию?)

"Conservative Party deputy leader Peter MacKay wants to scrap the costly federal gun registry system, and says the money spent to register firearms could go towards better police protection." (c) CTV news
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, June 17, 2004 10:19:00 AM
 
Я конечно понимаю, что в Израиловке тебе дали побряцать оружием, и тебя к нему тянет, но Канада не Израиль, слава тебе господи (хоть его и нет)...


В Израиле, мой дорогой товарищ, оружее почти у всех, но убийства и всякие проблемы там очень редки. Наверно это менталитет такой - каждый чел там имэущий оружее прошел армию и умеет им обращатся.

Сдесь оружее у:

1. Полиции и у Броне перевизщиков.
2. Охотников.
3. Любителей.
4. Гангстеры

Первые 3 не применяют оруже в насильных преступлениях (в 95% случаев). У группы 4 оружее нелегальное.

Какого члена контролировать оружее на которое и так нужен лайсенс, которое продается в магазине, которое всегда в любом случае регистрировалось на твое имя.

Давай вместо того чтобы бабки выкидывать на группы 2 и 3, от которых смертей в году в Онтарио не больше 10 и то от несщасных случаев, и сконцентрируем бабки на работу полиции и других органов, которые занимаются группой 4.

бен, и хватит своего сарказма, с личными наездами.
Joined: 12/21/2001
Posts: 30002
Posted on Thursday, June 17, 2004 10:19:00 AM
 
"Нет, мрс, мы, домовладельцы, должны одни платить налоги на недвижимость, при этом не получая никакого дохода от собственности. Так что правильно, что подняли... А что касается платы за жилье для жильцов - так не включайте добавленный налог в рент, а уменьшите свою прибыль... Так нет - не сделаете... И интересно сколько процентов от стоимости дома вы платите? КОнечно, меньше чем мы... И при этом можете все расходы списывать..."

Бен, хотела бы я тебя видеть на месте лендлорда... ты бы взвыл в первый же месяц. Короче, ВСЕ что ты написал не соотетствует действительноти. Начать хоть с того, что проперти тах 38% и растет каждый год(
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Saturday, June 19, 2004 8:44:00 AM
 
http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=thestar/Layout/Article_Type1&c=Article&cid=1087596610769&call_pageid=1012319932217&col=1012319928928


hi hi hi

The main issues raised by voters are the Liberal sponsorship scandal, the Ontario Liberal budget and its new health-care tax. And there is the general sense of anger.

"It's not that I have a big problem paying more for health care," says Rami Poticha, a 25-year-old financial services worker who came to Canada from Israel eight years ago.

"But it was forced upon me," he adds, referring to the Ontario health-care tax, which broke a McGuinty promise not to raise taxes. "It was not discussed."

Poticha, who says he will vote Conservative, is also miffed that Prime Minister Paul Martin claims little knowledge of the sponsorship scandal that took place while he was finance minister.

"You're a pretty crappy one if you don't know where the money is going."

Such comments clearly energize Johnson, who has a lot at stake in this election as the race between the Liberals and Conservatives tightens heading into the final week of campaigning.


--
Romka, NPSEntertainment
Joined: 10/1/2003
Posts: 6154
Posted on Saturday, June 19, 2004 10:43:00 AM
 
Мне кажется консерваторы начинают терять момент. Я позавчера это подумал, а вчера начал получать подтверждения из СМИ.

Недовольство либералами не значит любви к консерваторам и в последний момент люди просто передумают за них голосовать.

Насчёт знает незнает это всё догадки. Я вот вчера сказал что мне через стекло говорили т.к. сразу сказали что такого
неможет быть. На самом деле может если кричать. Тогда и через глухое стекло слышно. Другой пример: много вы знаете на работе? В основном свою долю. Может основные детали какой либо напрямую не относящейся к вам программы, но конкретных деталей реализации вероятно не знаете т.к. конкретно за нее реализацию не отвечаете.

В любом случае эта фигня на будующее не имеет никакого значения. Мне к примеру не нравится что либералы большей частью слишком либеральны в отношении браков геев. Я считаю что это не для геев. Пусть они хоть 10 раз все перерегистрируются, но пусть не трогают то что им не пренадлежит. Пусть проявят фантазию и что то себе придумают а не права качают. Однако это не такое принципиальный вопрос в долговременном плане. Народ успокоится лет через 5 и пример Европы это доказывает. Другие элементы либеральной программы более разумные и представляют более приемлемый компромис между экономическими, общественными и социальными нуждами.
Joined: 10/19/2003
Posts: 16244
Posted on Saturday, June 19, 2004 10:46:00 AM
 
Ракун

Тебе пора создавать КОНсомол:)
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Saturday, June 19, 2004 10:49:00 AM
 
Пусть проявят фантазию и что то себе придумают

lol
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Monday, August 9, 2004 2:30:00 PM
 
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Monday, August 9, 2004 2:33:00 PM
 
Joined: 6/11/2003
Posts: 1656
Posted on Monday, August 9, 2004 2:41:00 PM
 
Coon, Езра ещё старый консерватор, он новый проект замутил www.westernstandard.ca
а до этого он издавал Альбёрта Рипорт .
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Monday, August 9, 2004 2:50:00 PM
 
блин.. конспирация какаята - не могу статью найти - линк не работает (Езра написал) вощем про мудака из Канада Пост - бадди Пол Мартина который потратил 2 лимона на себя за последние 4 года

--
Joined: 8/4/2004
Posts: 229
Posted on Monday, August 9, 2004 2:50:00 PM
 
by the way, are you all Conservatives here????scarrrrrry.....
Joined: 6/11/2003
Posts: 1656
Posted on Monday, August 9, 2004 2:52:00 PM
 
kis, btw, are you all socialists here, scarryy....
Joined: 8/4/2004
Posts: 229
Posted on Monday, August 9, 2004 2:54:00 PM
 
Top:
btw, we are trying to find the way between verrry scarry conservatives and scarry socialists:)
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Monday, August 9, 2004 3:23:00 PM
 
yeah we all scarry
Joined: 6/11/2003
Posts: 1656
Posted on Monday, August 9, 2004 3:24:00 PM
 
scarred i'd say ;p
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Monday, August 9, 2004 3:27:00 PM
 
lol

anyways.. looks like John Tory is going to replace Eves for provincial leadership... what do you think about that?
Joined: 6/11/2003
Posts: 1656
Posted on Monday, August 9, 2004 3:29:00 PM
 
awesome
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Monday, August 9, 2004 3:32:00 PM
 
I like the sound of that, I think enough lawyers, we need a businessman, and a f'n succesfull one
Joined: 10/1/2003
Posts: 6154
Posted on Monday, August 9, 2004 8:03:00 PM
 
I think the worst is over for McGuinty's government.
It is a while till the next election wave comes and they have a good chance to start making something positive. If they are successful, they are likely to recover and improve their record by the next election.
Joined: 6/29/2003
Posts: 6857
Posted on Monday, August 9, 2004 10:17:00 PM
 
Кстати, в Папуа-Новой Гвинее правят либералы. И ничего, живут припеваючи и никто не жалуется.


--
Ракун, ты заебал!
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Tuesday, August 10, 2004 2:44:00 PM
 
Top: do you think Tory is electable since the federal election disaster in 88 ?
Joined: 6/11/2003
Posts: 1656
Posted on Tuesday, August 10, 2004 2:47:00 PM
 
Marx, you need professional help, seriously, dude.
You want Sir Liesalot (re: today's sun editorial) AGAIN?

"Dalton McGuinty won the last election in part because he promised not to raise taxes.



He broke that promise. The Liberals actually hit Ontarians with the largest tax hike this province has seen in 11 years.



He also promised not to raise taxes without a referendum.



He broke that promise too. Now he says we can’t afford a referendum.



In other words, the problem with Dalton McGuinty isn’t just that he is assaulting your wallet, although that is bad enough. The real problem is that we have a Premier who won’t keep his word."

Ontario deserves better. Ontario needs better.


http://www.morefreedom.org/NCCLive/campaigns/campaignsArticle.jsp?ArticleID=135

dr


Joined: 6/11/2003
Posts: 1656
Posted on Tuesday, August 10, 2004 2:48:00 PM
 
Coon, I sure hope so. If socialist Toronto chose him second to Miller he has a good chance. Too bad he is an unknown, but this is Canada after all.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Tuesday, August 10, 2004 2:50:00 PM
 
I am just tired of the liers .. i mean lawers
Joined: 6/11/2003
Posts: 1656
Posted on Tuesday, August 10, 2004 2:51:00 PM
 
lol
Joined: 6/11/2003
Posts: 1656
Posted on Tuesday, August 10, 2004 2:53:00 PM
 
A Republican and a Democrat were walking down the street when they came to a homeless person. The Republican gave the homeless person his business card and told him to come to his business for a job. He then took twenty dollars out of his pocket and gave it to the homeless person.

The Democrat was very impressed, and when they came to another homeless person, he decided to help. He walked over to the homeless person and gave him directions to the welfare office. He then reached into the Republican's pocket and gave the homeless person fifty dollars.
Joined: 6/11/2003
Posts: 1656
Posted on Tuesday, August 10, 2004 2:54:00 PM
 
Democratic National Convention Schedule

Boston, Massachusetts

6:00 PM - Opening Flag Burning Ceremony
6:05 PM - Pledge of Allegiance to the U.N.
6:15 PM - Secular Prayers by Rev. Jesse Jackson and Rev. Al Sharpton
6:30 PM - Antiwar Concert by Barbara Streisand
6:40 PM - Ted Kennedy Proposes a Toast
7:00 PM - Tribute to France
7:10 PM - Collect Offerings for al-Zawahri Defense Fund
7:25 PM - Tribute to Germany
7:45 PM - Antiwar Rally (Moderated by Michael Moore)
8:25 PM - Ted Kennedy Proposes a Toast
8:30 PM - Terrorist Appeasement Workshop
9:00 PM - Roundtable Discussion of Taxes: "Calling for Higher Taxes on Others While You Pay None"
9:15 PM - Bill & Hillary Clinton Host a Seminar on "The Successful Selling of White House & Air Force One Mementos on eBay"
9:20 PM - Gay Marriage Ceremony (Both Male and Female Couples)
9:30 PM - * Intermission * Special Guest Soloist Jane Fonda
10:00 PM - Posting the Iraqi Colors by Sean Penn and Tim Robbins
10:10 PM - Reenactment of Kerry's Fake Medal Toss
10:20 PM - Howard Dean Screamfest 'Yeeearrrrrrrg!'
10:30 PM - Seminar: "The Boy Scouts and Other Paramilitary threats to National Security"
10:40 PM - Ted Kennedy Proposes a Toast
10:45 PM - Abortion Demonstration (NARAL)
11:00 PM - Multiple Gay Marriage Ceremony (Threesomes, Mixed and Same-Sex)
11:15 PM - 'Maximizing Welfare' Workshop
11:30 PM - 'Free Saddam' Pep Rally
11:50 PM - Ted Kennedy Proposes a Toast
12:00 AM - Kerry-Edwards 2004 Sealed With A Kiss
12:01 AM - Ted Kennedy Proposes a Toast
12:02 AM - Ted Kennedy Proposes a Toast

Joined: 6/11/2003
Posts: 1656
Posted on Tuesday, August 10, 2004 2:56:00 PM
 
Bush met with former President Jimmy Carter. Jimmy Carter is 76 years old, or as Democrats call him 'their bright new star of the future.'" —David Letterman
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Tuesday, August 10, 2004 3:15:00 PM
 
lol
Joined: 10/1/2003
Posts: 6154
Posted on Tuesday, August 10, 2004 3:30:00 PM
 
Top politicians have 2 options: to go populist way and to go responsible way. I voted liberal, because I believed they will pick the responsible way to govern, not to do something just for the sake of doing it (even if it means breaking some promises or cutting back on them).

Conservative government after the years of being responsible forgot that they also have to be caring and tried to compensate it through populist measures. They lost.

At the same time you you should remember that Ernie Eves could not explain people anything about his intentions but brushing off questions "It is not done this way... ", "Government does not work this way.. " How does it work then????

Well, I do not really care about colours. I am not a bull. :P
Just look at this leaving aside your hardcoded political preferences.
Joined: 6/11/2003
Posts: 1656
Posted on Tuesday, August 10, 2004 3:47:00 PM
 
marx, you believed in Fiberals ?
my god, you are not 18, are ya ?

p.s. eves didn't represent conservatives last election, in fact, no one did, that's why moderate conservatives voted liberal to punish eves. bad strategy, but effective. landslide victory for liesalot.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Tuesday, August 10, 2004 3:49:00 PM
 
McGuilty should be impeached
Joined: 6/11/2003
Posts: 1656
Posted on Tuesday, August 10, 2004 3:50:00 PM
 
this isn't America
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Tuesday, August 10, 2004 3:51:00 PM
 
too fuckin bad
Joined: 6/11/2003
Posts: 1656
Posted on Tuesday, August 10, 2004 3:53:00 PM
 
in this matter yes
overall... well, dunno if you can perceive it the way i do : there is goodness to things unique...
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, August 12, 2004 9:36:00 AM
 
Drowning in debt

Linda Leatherdale wades in on the horrific numbers just released by StatsCan that show each Ontarian is in the hole for $8,416, while Albertans are ahead by $3,366

By LINDA LEATHERDALE, BUSINESS EDITOR




IS DEBT a dirty word? Not to NDP leader Jack Layton, who not only wants us to believe Canadians do not want lower taxes, but we don't care if governments pay down their debt.

Yet, the bottom line is this: Today's debts are tomorrow's taxes. So all Canadians should find this report interesting.

People who live in Newfoundland and Labrador bear the biggest provincial government debt burden in the country -- owing $18,326 each in 2003.

But you're in the black if you live in the Yukon, the Northwest Territories or Alberta, according to a debt report released yesterday by Statistics Canada.

ALBERTA'S SUCCESS

In the Yukon, each taxpayer is ahead by $8,452; in the NWT, $4,381; and in Alberta -- where Premier Ralph Klein was brave enough to slay the debt dragon -- $3,366.

What a difference to 1993, when Alberta's net debt peaked at $22.7 billion and each Albertan owed $8,500.

"Alberta's success in reigning in spending, running surpluses, and paying off debt deserves much more attention," says John Williamson, federal director of the Canadian Taxpayers Federation (CTF).

"Yet, given the nature of our political culture, many taxpayers and public policy makers, have chalked up Alberta's debt-free status as dumb luck thanks to fat oil revenues. Alberta's success is not the result of Premier Klein clicking his heels and wishing the debt away. It is the product of his early policies," he said.

Those policies included eliminating the province's deficit by 1995, cutting spending, and passing a law that ruled the net debt be eliminated by 2025.

And where do we stand in Ontario?

Each of us was in the hole by $8,416 in 2003, according to StatsCan.

Warning: This burden is going to get worse after Dalton McGuinty's Liberals broke a number of election promises to not only scrap the CTF's Taxpayer Protection Act (that's after they signed the pledge on the election trail) -- but to hike taxes by $2 billion and let our net debt soar to $142 billion.

The StatsCan report shows Quebecers also bear heavy government debt burdens, at $12,757 each; followed by Nova Scotians at $12,714. The list of those in the red goes on:

- Saskatchewan -- $9,927

- Nunavut -- $9,586

- Manitoba -- $8,808

- Prince Edward Island -- $8,394

- New Brunswick -- $7,884

- British Columbia -- $4,864

Overall, the net debt of provincial and territorial governments reached $255.9 billion in 2003, says StatsCan, for an increase of $6.4 billion or 2.6% from March 31, 2002. Per person that's $8,112, up from $7,980.

Net debt, by the way, is financial assets minus liabilities.

In Ottawa -- where the Liberals have managed to wipe out annual deficits and are sitting on a surplus -- the country's net debt still stands at $510.6 billion.

"The federal government was successful in eliminating the national deficit but has not made debt repayment a priority," complains CTF's Williamson, who urges Ottawa to pass debt reduction laws.

Still, Prime Minister Paul Martin has pledged to pay down the net debt to $508.7 billion in 2004-05. He's also promised to reduce the net debt to 25% of GDP (gross domestic product or economic growth) within a decade, from its peak of 68.4% in 1995-96.

"Even at that rate it will take more than 40 years before Canada is debt free," said Williamson.

Now, imagine if Layton was Prime Minister.

Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Monday, September 13, 2004 8:21:00 PM
 
Follow The Leader





The work week has just begun, but many Ontarians are already looking ahead to the weekend. That’s when Conservative Party members will pick who they want to take over for current Tory boss Ernie Eves.

The leadership race is in the final stretch as those vying for the job of top Tory go full speed ahead. Hopeful Jim Flaherty is spending the week touring coffee shops throughout Ontario, as he wants to chat about politics with everyday people. Flaherty, the former finance minister, claims he’s the best candidate to topple Premier Dalton McGuinty in the next vote.

He hopes to bring the Tories back to their conservative roots, instead of attempting to be “middle-of-the-road Liberal wannabes.” That was his jab at John Tory, who is viewed as being a more moderate conservative. Tory, who ran for mayor of Toronto last year and lost to David Miller, is also running for Conservative Leader.

Frank Klees, the former transportation minister, is the third candidate in the race.

The leadership convention kicks off on Friday and the vote results will be revealed on Saturday afternoon.






September 13, 2004




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


--
Its like deja vu all over again.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Monday, September 13, 2004 8:23:00 PM
 
Grit-ted Teeth





They didn't deliver on their promises. They floated trial balloons on new programs that quickly deflated. And they instituted a health care premium on your paycheque without letting you know it was coming.

It's little wonder that 10 months after being elected in a landslide, the McGuinty Liberals are seeing their fortunes fall fast in the minds of many voters.

How bad have things become? A new Ipsos-Reid poll shows that if an election were held today, the Conservatives would win at Queen's Park - even without officially having elected a new leader!

Some 35 percent of decided voters would put the Tories back in charge, while only 32 percent would make another mark for the Grits. The N.D.P. would garner 24 percent and the Greens, 8.

Rarely has a so-called honeymoon worn off faster than with the current regime. And while that judgement is based mainly on recent and past performances, it doesn't appear most like what they see down the road, either.

At least 52 percent think McGuinty's team is taking Ontario in the wrong direction. Only 42 percent like what the Liberals are doing.

But perhaps the most telling stat may be the Premier's own popularity. Some 69 percent of those asked don't like the way he's been doing his job. Only 29 percent approve.

The numbers don't bode well for the Liberals, but time is on their side. There's still three long years before the next election, the P.C.s have yet to find a proven leader and have a lot of bad will to overcome, and voter memories are traditionally short. But it's apparent some, at least, don't plan to forget.

Because of changes made by the Liberals, we know when they'll face that test. The fixed date for the next Ontario election is October 4, 2007.





September 9, 2004


--
Its like deja vu all over again.
Joined: 10/1/2003
Posts: 6154
Posted on Monday, September 13, 2004 8:39:00 PM
 
Никто бы не голосовал за партию без лидера.
Ситуация аналогичная существовавшей перед федеральными выборам. Недовольство одной стороной не значит любви к другой.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Monday, September 13, 2004 8:41:00 PM
 
маркс : нашел чем гордится!

--
Its like deja vu all over again.
Joined: 10/1/2003
Posts: 6154
Posted on Monday, September 13, 2004 8:45:00 PM
 
Я не горжусь. Я анализирую. Я сам не в большом восторге. Просто наблюдаю за прогрессом. Даю шанс типа... :))
Joined: 3/25/2002
Posts: 2486
Posted on Tuesday, September 14, 2004 10:49:00 AM
 
ER and Thor,
Are you paying attetion to what's happening to the south of the border, pretty exciting stuff. Bush 'em all.
Joined: 10/1/2003
Posts: 6154
Posted on Tuesday, September 14, 2004 10:58:00 AM
 
POS что ты имеешь в виду?
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Tuesday, September 14, 2004 11:10:00 AM
 
PoS, long time no see, dude
we should hang out

marx, elections, DUH. =)
Joined: 10/1/2003
Posts: 6154
Posted on Tuesday, September 14, 2004 11:37:00 AM
 
Oh... I guess, I nothing excites me there yet. ;)
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Tuesday, September 14, 2004 11:38:00 AM
 
PoS!!! been a long time .. where did ya go?



--
Its like deja vu all over again.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Friday, September 17, 2004 9:05:00 AM
 
blabla

--
Its like deja vu all over again.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Saturday, September 18, 2004 9:19:00 AM
 
Tory leadership trio make their final vows

PARTY VOTES TODAY ON NEW CHIEF

By ANTONELLA ARTUSO, QUEEN'S PARK BUREAU CHIEF




THE THREE Progressive Conservative leadership candidates -- John Tory, Jim Flaherty and Frank Klees -- made last-minute, do-or-die pitches for the top job yesterday. Three Tory premiers, Mike Harris, Ernie Eves and Bill Davis -- introduced to loud cheering, joined with hundreds of enthusiastic party members last night to listen to the three candidates' final speeches before today's vote for Ontario's new PC leader.

Federal Conservative Leader Stephen Harper was also on hand.

Tory, a long-standing party member but the only leadership candidate without a seat in the legislature, said the party must attract new supporters, people who may have been scared away in the past. "We've got to reach out to women, to newer Canadians and to young people," Tory said.

the rest here... http://www.canoe.ca/NewsStand/TorontoSun/News/2004/09/18/633636.html

--
Its like deja vu all over again.
Joined: 10/19/2003
Posts: 16244
Posted on Saturday, September 18, 2004 10:47:00 AM
 
Tory - for Tory!
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Saturday, September 18, 2004 10:55:00 AM
 
I like Frank Klees. He's got some healthy ideas.

--
Its like deja vu all over again.
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Sunday, September 19, 2004 12:13:00 AM
 
слава кому угодно, Тори выиграл. Хоть на следующих выборах не будет ощущения, что к власти могу вернуться эти мерзкие фашистские рожи, которые нравятся всяким енотам...
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Sunday, September 19, 2004 12:10:00 PM
 
ben.. кто бы говорил о фашизме, главный фашист-коммуняга форума у которово ник в простом переводе значит член.

--
Its like deja vu all over again.
Joined: 10/19/2003
Posts: 16244
Posted on Sunday, September 19, 2004 12:17:00 PM
 
Raccoon

ben не фашист и не коммуняга. Он НДП, а это еще хуже. У тех хоть честные программы были: тех разорить.,этих расстрелять и т.д.

А у НДП нет вообще никакой экономической программы. Хоть они себя и именуют социалистами, у них нет ни единого пункта в программе о трудовом законодательстве ( об увеличении отпусков, как европейские социал-демократы делают). Они - никто.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Sunday, September 19, 2004 12:20:00 PM
 
Миллер смешной - НДП 100%.. когда заявил.. "а мне пох куда гарбидж вести, это проблема грузовой-компании"

НДП любит на других все свалить, пальцем показать а сами нехуя не умеют и не знают

--
Its like deja vu all over again.
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Monday, September 20, 2004 10:29:00 AM
 
При чем тут НДП? Тут шла речь о руководстве Кон партии. Кстати, я стал поддерживать НДП только тогда, когда произошел этот дикий крен вправо. Сейчас произошло движение к центру на всех уроднях, можно опять быть центристом.

Кстати, Миллер имеет очень разумную позицию по мусору. Просто, надо ресайклингом заниматься всего.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Monday, September 20, 2004 11:50:00 AM
 
Все не перересайклишь и то что наш город может скоро превратицца в одну большую помойку его не колышит

--
Its like deja vu all over again.
Joined: 11/29/2001
Posts: 19958
Posted on Monday, September 20, 2004 12:03:00 PM
 
ник в простом переводе значит член.

это на твоем родном хибру что-ли? :)) гыгы
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Monday, September 20, 2004 12:04:00 PM
 
Rusa: нет на иврите ето Заин..

--
Its like deja vu all over again.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Monday, September 20, 2004 1:04:00 PM
 
Tory seems okay... Praising Harris was good, following his agenda would be better. Common sense, hopefully, is on the way.
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Monday, September 20, 2004 1:08:00 PM
 
Тор, значит ты не понял, что вся избирательная кампания была вокруг темы: отвергнуть или принять фашистский консерватизм. Те, кто выступали за, голосовали за Фларети. Тут вернулись к власти пинк Ториз (а ля Бил Дейвис, который 20 лет правил в Онтарио).
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Monday, September 20, 2004 1:10:00 PM
 
ben, define fascist conservatism
Joined: 11/29/2001
Posts: 19958
Posted on Monday, September 20, 2004 1:16:00 PM
 
это какие-то специфические рожи, которые нравятся енотам :)
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Monday, September 20, 2004 1:19:00 PM
 
social conservatism (mysoginism, homophobia, racism, anti-abortion, etc.) plus economic conservatism (non-universal health care, income gap, anti-environmental policies, etc.).
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Monday, September 20, 2004 1:19:00 PM
 
енотам, которые сами признают, что злые!
Joined: 11/29/2001
Posts: 19958
Posted on Monday, September 20, 2004 1:25:00 PM
 
а еще злые еноты говорили, что бен значит что-то неприличное на каком-то загадочном языке
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Monday, September 20, 2004 1:26:00 PM
 
mysoginism, homophobia, racism, anti-abortion, etc

you must be on crack to assert this is social conservatism...

non-universal health care, income gap, anti-environmental policies, etc

health-care... anti-env... ? where do you come up with these ?

Joined: 11/29/2001
Posts: 19958
Posted on Monday, September 20, 2004 1:31:00 PM
 
Тор, а беня все-таки прав :)
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Monday, September 20, 2004 1:32:00 PM
 
Whatever helps you sleep at nite, dear.
or rather should I say : get you thru the nite ?
...
Joined: 11/29/2001
Posts: 19958
Posted on Monday, September 20, 2004 1:39:00 PM
 
Тор, ты мне сейчас напоминаешь некотрый сегмент людей, которые считают, что есть их мнение и неправильное :)
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Monday, September 20, 2004 1:45:00 PM
 
homophobia is not a policy its a right ;)

--
Its like deja vu all over again.
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Monday, September 20, 2004 1:46:00 PM
 
so, Thor, you now see (ER's last comment) what I mean referring to fascist conservatism?
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Monday, September 20, 2004 1:52:00 PM
 
Bs..

if i dont like gay people or other ethnic group i think its my right to not like them, however i dont have a right to openly propogate or resort to violence or criminal mischief to voice my opinion.




--
Its like deja vu all over again.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Monday, September 20, 2004 2:00:00 PM
 
ben, yes, Racoon's comments often are quite offensive.
though what that has to do with the conservatism ?
it's his personal biases and prejudices that definitely don't represent any official party and/or theory platform/s.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Monday, September 20, 2004 2:02:00 PM
 
Руска, лол =)
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Monday, September 20, 2004 2:04:00 PM
 
ben:

blabla

--
Its like deja vu all over again.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Monday, September 20, 2004 2:05:00 PM
 
He calls himself a fresh face for the once mighty Conservative Party.

On Saturday John Tory became the new leader of Ontario’s Progressive Conservatives – a win that signifies the party’s move to the political centre. His main rival Jim Flaherty represented the party’s right wing and stressed his alliance with former premier Mike Harris. The third candidate Frank Klees holds similar views and wanted to create a parallel private/public health care system.

It took two ballots for Tory, 50, to win the leadership. Many consider him a political novice because he has never been elected to public office, but he’s no rookie. He has spent more than 35 years behind the scenes working as a campaign leader, party advisor and volunteer. On Saturday he finally stepped out into the spotlight.

His first foray as a political candidate turned out to be quite successful. He placed a respectable second to David Miller in Toronto’s mayoral race last year. His rivals in the latest contest tried to capitalize on his apparent inexperience, but Tory has been involved with the Conservatives at every level since he was a young man.

The Ontario Tories were looking "for someone who is going to give the party a more middle-of-the-road edge to it because that's, I think, what the majority believes is going to take to win the next election," said Ryerson University politics professor John Shields.

Tory finally decided to run for politics because it was a way he felt he could make significant change.

“Government has so much influence on how things happen, whether it's in terms of addressing social problems or how business can flourish and create jobs or just how people can live their lives," he said.




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


A sketch of Ontario Progressive Conservative Leader John Tory's career:


Beginnings: Never before been elected to office; placed second in last year's Toronto mayoral race.
Career: Veteran party strategist and former aide to premier Bill Davis, who endorsed Tory's leadership bid. Former C.E.O. of Rogers Cable and former CFL commissioner. He has been an organizer on every federal or provincial Conservative campaign for decades, from former prime ministers Kim Campbell and Brian Mulroney to former premier Mike Harris. He also co-chaired former Toronto mayor Mel Lastman’s campaigns.
Age: 50.
Personal: Married to Barbara Hackett; has four children: John, Christopher, Susan and George.
Quote: "For our party, this is the end of the beginning. For (Liberal Premier) Dalton McGuinty today marks the beginning of the end."

Edited by - evil raccoon on 9/20/2004 2:12:30 PM
Joined: 10/19/2003
Posts: 16244
Posted on Monday, September 20, 2004 2:19:00 PM
 
"Дотронувшись до него, Денис понял, что "Бен" уже готов и трепещет. Денис предполагал заняться Этим после того, как он вернётся в комнату, но почему бы и нет? Он медленно, тихо расстегнул штаны, вытащил твёрдый и напряжённый "Бен" наружу и начал..."


http://216.109.117.135/search/cache?p=%D0%B4%D1%80%D0%BE%D1%87%D0%B8%D1%82%D1%8C+%D0%B1%D0%B5%D0%BD%D0%B0&ei=UTF-8&cop=mss&u=r.adt.ru/ppp.htm&w=%D0%B4%D1%80%D0%BE%D1%87%D0%B8%D1%82%D1%8C+%D0%B1%D0%B5%D0%BD%D0%B0&d=A22BA4398D&icp=1&.intl=us

Joined: 11/29/2001
Posts: 19958
Posted on Monday, September 20, 2004 2:22:00 PM
 
теперь понятно почему big ben :)) гыгы
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Thursday, October 7, 2004 3:47:00 PM
 
Speech's promises and commitments are already stale
Conservatives and Bloc add air of uncertainty

John Ivison
National Post


October 6, 2004


ON THE HILL - As the Governor-General was clearing her throat in preparation for the Throne Speech early yesterday afternoon, news began to filter through that HMCS Chicoutimi was dead in the water off the coast of Ireland, waiting to be tugged back to the U.K. by Royal Navy frigates.

Nothing was injured in the small fire aboard the submarine, apart from the pride of Canada's navy, which only took possession of the former HMS Upholder last Saturday. But the infelicity of the accident leads one to wonder if there isn't something in the old seafarer's tale about renaming boats bringing nothing but bad luck. Maritime legend has it that each and every vessel is recorded by name in the Ledger of the Deep and is known personally to Poseidon.

Perhaps the Powers that make politicians their care become similarly aggrieved when parties attempt to disown their past: It would certainly explain the misfortunes that have beset the Paul Martin government since its coronation last December. Pretty much the only thing that has gone right since then has been Stephen Harper's apparent disinterest in becoming prime minister. Certainly the Conservative leader's tactic of equivocating on social issues and disappearing in the final week of the campaign worked a treat, if his goal was to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.

From the Martin camp we have heard a great deal of blather about ''building a 21st-century economy''; about developing ''a role of pride and influence'' in the world; and about ''strengthening our social foundations.'' The problem is we've already heard about these ''priorities'' in a Throne Speech and an election platform, with scant evidence of much progress in any of them -- and I include in that the pledge to fix health care for a generation.

Yesterday, the Governor-General bored for Canada. After the interminable wait for Black Rod to dodder to the House of Commons and back again, leading an unruly crocodile of MPs, Adrienne Clarkson reprised Paul Martin's collection of election promises.

There were pledges to introduce a national child care program; to create a ''strategy for the North'' aimed at improving the standard of living for aboriginal Canadians; to build on the Smart Borders program to help improve access to the United States for softwood lumber and Canadian cattle; to institute a New Deal for Canada's Cities and Communities; and to implement a national plan to address the Kyoto Accord on climate change.

But many of these commitments are curling up at the edges like stale sandwiches. The government promised to implement a child care program a decade ago; to meet Kyoto commitments five years ago; and to meet First Nations' employment, housing and social needs three years ago.

The lack of detail about how it might fulfill its promises did not seem to bother Jack Layton, the NDP leader, who indicated his Damascene conversion to the Liberal cause by saying the speech ''moves in a good direction,'' particularly with its nod toward electoral reform and Kyoto implementation. The National Citizens' Coalition went as far as to call the speech a ''love note from the Liberals to the NDP.''

But a flutter of uncertainty must have passed through government House leader Tony Valeri when he heard Harper and Bloc leader Gilles Duceppe both say they could not support the speech in its current form. Harper said he would propose an amendment, ''things that our party and other parties can support.'' Duceppe has already written to Martin, urging him to address the fiscal imbalance, reform Employment Insurance and introduce votes in the House on international treaties, and it seems likely the Conservative amendment will be along these lines. Valeri has already said he is open to
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Thursday, October 7, 2004 3:48:00 PM
 
Throne Speech A Love Note for NDP

(Toronto October 5, 2004) The National Citizens Coalition says today’s Throne Speech was like a love note from the Liberals to the NDP.



“Clearly, Prime Minister Martin is using this speech to reach out for NDP support in this minority House,” says NCC vice president Gerry Nicholls. “The speech promised more spending, more costly programs and more government. It did not mention tax cuts.”



Nicholls also notes the government still has not clarified how it will implement the Kyoto Treaty.



“In today’s speech the government says it will implement Kyoto without harming the economy,” says Nicholls, “but economic experts say that can’t be done. How will the Liberals do it.”



Nicholls was glad the government at least noted the military needed more support, but says it should be doing more to help our armed forces.



“The military has been neglected long enough,” says Nicholls. “The government should be making a serious effort to bolster our defence.”



Gerry Nicholls
Vice President
National Citizens Coalition
www.morefreedom.org

Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Thursday, October 7, 2004 6:19:00 PM
 
vote of non-confidence might be raised soon...
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Friday, October 8, 2004 5:51:00 PM
 
не прошло, но дали Либералам по яйцам.. теперь будут знать что они больше не в большинстве и просто так с рук ничего не сойдет.

Лейтон по радио вчера извращался как мог, вот клон нах!

--
Its like deja vu all over again.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Tuesday, October 19, 2004 10:05:00 AM
 
Is Nobody bothered by the fact that the gov't announced 8 billion dollar surplus and we are still being robbed blind???

--
Its like deja vu all over again.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Tuesday, October 19, 2004 11:23:00 AM
 
Well...
that's the reason the Fiberals get re-elected...

Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Tuesday, October 19, 2004 12:43:00 PM
 
Ракун, просто вы все - только условные консерваторы. Федеральное правительство использует эти деньги, чтобы выплачивать долг, и успело за последние годы погасить его на 60 миллиардов, так что у нас теперь самый низкий гос долг по отношению к ВВП среди стран большой семерки.

Я всегда говорил, что вы все - не настоящие консерваторы, которые только приветствуют выплату долга, а настоящие жлобы.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Tuesday, October 19, 2004 12:48:00 PM
 
ben, долг нужно выплатить, это само собой разумеецца,
но посмотри на состояние армии, госпиталей, школ ?
откуда беруцца деньги на gun registry program и не хватает для здравохранения?

Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Tuesday, October 19, 2004 12:53:00 PM
 
деньги тратятся так, как голосует наш парламент. кто-нибудь был когда-нибудь полностью удовлетворен всеми расходами? это всегда компромисс. я, например, считаю, что деньги не надо тратить на gun registry, а надо полностью запретить частное владение оружием. И тратить деньги на конфискацию его и осмотр всех машин на границе с Штатами, которые экспортируют свою преступность к нам.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Tuesday, October 19, 2004 1:01:00 PM
 
не запретят здесь оружие, хотя кто его знает ; псевдосоциализм задрал уже.

деньги тратяцца ... пиздяцца через АдСкэм.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Tuesday, October 19, 2004 1:06:00 PM
 
вощем гнать надо всех этих французиков из гавермента

--
Its like deja vu all over again.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Tuesday, October 19, 2004 1:08:00 PM
 
ты гонишь
мож евреев погнать с Канады?
песец.
Joined: 1/30/2003
Posts: 22206
Posted on Tuesday, October 19, 2004 1:13:00 PM
 
И тратить деньги на конфискацию его и осмотр всех машин на границе с Штатами, которые экспортируют свою преступность к нам

God bless Amierica ; ))) - the ultimate provider of cheap and hight quality cocaine for "Doughnut-banging bacon-wrapped maplefuckers"
Joined: 1/30/2003
Posts: 22206
Posted on Tuesday, October 19, 2004 1:17:00 PM
 
В америке кстати сняли бан на ассолт вепонс недавно... так.. для справки...
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Tuesday, October 19, 2004 1:18:00 PM
 
d
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Tuesday, October 19, 2004 1:20:00 PM
 
зацените стикер на этой тачке

NO FREEDOM IN CANADA гыгыгы

d
Joined: 1/30/2003
Posts: 22206
Posted on Tuesday, October 19, 2004 1:22:00 PM
 
LOL
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Tuesday, October 19, 2004 1:24:00 PM
 
интересно, как они статистику ведут в отношении того, кто сколько предовратил преступлений. наверное, члены НРА сами предоставляют справки своему лобби в Вашингтоне.

Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Tuesday, October 19, 2004 1:24:00 PM
 
“The military has been neglected long enough,” says Nicholls. “The government should be making a serious effort to bolster our defence.”

this is before the sub disaster...
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Tuesday, October 19, 2004 1:26:00 PM
 
А ведь ты скептичен только относительно таких фактов.
Просто поразительно как человек стоит на одном
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Tuesday, October 19, 2004 1:28:00 PM
 
Камский,
вот те сцылка на статью о assault weapon ban если интересно
http://www.gunsandcrime.org/awban.html#top
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Tuesday, October 19, 2004 1:29:00 PM
 
ben, they get their numbers from statistics
there is a column on your left that provides quite a lot of it.

http://www.instantknowledgenews.com/indexnews2.htm
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Tuesday, October 19, 2004 2:19:00 PM
 
Тор, это примерно как верить информации о Холокосте на основании статистики, полученной с официального сайта национал-социалистической партии германии.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Tuesday, October 19, 2004 2:29:00 PM
 
лол
там же статистика с сайтов FBI, Justice Dept, Sourcebook of Criminal Justice Statistics, SSBR: Crime, US Crime Statistics Total and by State 1960 - 2000 etc
не смеши =)
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Thursday, November 18, 2004 4:19:00 PM
 
infamous Carolyn Parrish got kicked out of Liberal caucus!
Paul Martin well done!
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Thursday, April 7, 2005 3:10:00 PM
 
so shit hits the fan

the sponsorship scandal unveils another level of corruption, mismanagement and leading to the mob.

Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Thursday, April 7, 2005 3:11:00 PM
 
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20050407.wbanlift0407a/BNStory/Front/

Gomery partially lifts ban on volatile testimonyBy ALLISON DUNFIELD

Thursday, April 7, 2005 Updated at 2:05 PM EST

Globe and Mail Update

Mr. Justice John Gomery has partially removed a ban on the volatile testimony from ad executive Jean Brault at the sponsorship inquiry.

However, the judge overseeing the sponsorship probe ruled Thursday that certain aspects of testimony provided by ad executive Jean Brault to the sponsorship inquiry can not be reported by the media.

"It is in the public interest that this evidence with few exceptions be made available to the public remembering that publication bans are a violation of constitutional rights and are to be imposed rarely, particularly in the context of a public inquiry," Judge Gomery said.

Both the Liberals and the opposition parties have been waiting in tense anticipation for the judge's decision.

The opposition believes that some information contained in Mr. Brault's testimony could be extremely harmful to the Liberals if it is made public.

It could also prompt them to call for a vote of non-confidence in the government and bring it down, triggering an election.

Mr. Brault is the former owner of Groupaction. Groupaction is one of the advertising firms at the heart of the sponsorship probe. The Gomery probe is looking into how $100-million of the Liberal government's $250-million sponsorship program went to Liberal-friendly agencies that did little or no work for the money.

More to come

fuck yeah more to come!
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Thursday, April 7, 2005 3:12:00 PM
 
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/Page/document/v4/sub/MarketingPage?user_URL=http://www.theglobeandmail.com%2Fservlet%2Fstory%2FRTGAM.20050318.GOMERY18_COPY%2FBNStory&ord=1112900977258&brand=theglobeandmail&force_login=true

Ad firm hid payments to Liberals, Gomery told

With a report from Campbell Clark

Friday, March 18, 2005

An advertising firm at the heart of the sponsorship scandal camouflaged tens of thousands of dollars in payments to the Liberal Party and to Liberal organizers through one of its subsidiaries in Quebec City, the Gomery inquiry heard yesterday.

Payments in cash - mafia style bribes pay offs
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, April 7, 2005 3:26:00 PM
 
MONTREAL (CP) - Top federal Liberal officials forced an ad executive to secretly divert more than $1 million to the party's Quebec wing in exchange for sponsorship contracts, the executive told the Gomery inquiry in politically explosive testimony that had been kept under wraps by a publication ban that was finally lifted Thursday.

The allegations of a longstanding corruption could give the opposition ammunition to move to bring down the government.

Advertising executive Jean Brault's testimony alleges some top Liberal party executives conspired to inflate sponsorship contracts and skim money off the top to be sent covertly to the Liberal party's Quebec wing.

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Politics/2005/02/27/944408-cp.html
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Thursday, April 7, 2005 4:07:00 PM
 
питачок вроде ссылку давал на captain's quarters blog, где освещают investigation.
а вот, нашёл

http://www.captainsquartersblog.com/mt/

Brault claims in his testimony that he systematically kicked back huge amounts of taxpayer money to the federal Liberal party, a deception he claims involved senior Liberal organizers and people close to former prime minister Jean Chretien.
His testimony detailed secret meetings, phoney paper trails, envelopes stuffed with cash and bogus billings.


* He said there were phoney employees on the payroll at the ad firm Groupaction.
* Brault said there was $1 million in kickbacks to the Liberal Party of Canada.
* His reward, he claims, was $172 million in government business for his firm.

It was always the same story, he told the commission. The Liberal Party needs money. If you want the business, you have to pay
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, April 7, 2005 4:11:00 PM
 
всех в тюрму бля.. и в не в минимум секюрити а в Эс паундинг максимум секюрити фасилити
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Thursday, April 7, 2005 4:14:00 PM
 
wait till CNN gets on top of this
this is Montreal mafia, guys, serious folks
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, April 7, 2005 4:23:00 PM
 
gotta watch Tonites show
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Friday, April 8, 2005 2:20:00 PM
 
Scandal worries Martin

By ALEXANDER PANETTA




OTTAWA (CP) - A government reeling in scandal issued a challenge to its opponents Friday: Hold off on an election until after the sponsorship inquiry.

The move to lob the political ball to the Conservatives comes amid speculation opposition parties could make swift political use of devastating revelations of Liberal wrongdoing in the sponsorship file splashed across front pages Friday. With the Liberal minority government's survival on shaky ground, opposition parties have indicated they'll be polling frantically in the next few days to see whether the scandal moves public opinion.

If enough people appear to be moving away from the Liberals there will likely be a spring election, they suggested.

"The challenge that this Liberal government issues to Stephen Harper and the Conservatives today is this," said Martin spokesman Scott Reid.

"Will the leader of the Opposition give Canadians a guarantee that he will let Justice (John) Gomery report his findings - that he will not force voters into an election until they have the answers that this prime minister has said that they deserve?"

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Politics/2005/04/08/988237-cp.html

Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Friday, April 8, 2005 4:45:00 PM
 
they are indeed going down.

Joined: 10/19/2003
Posts: 16244
Posted on Saturday, April 9, 2005 2:01:00 AM
 
The problem is:

DO the Conservatives go up? I jeopardise that NDP will benefit.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Monday, April 11, 2005 9:08:00 PM
 
All opposition parties kept up the sponsorship pressure on the Liberals in question period on Monday.

In response, Prime Minister Paul Martin and Public Works Minister Scott Brison were busy trying to paint their beleaguered government as being devoted to getting answers for Canadians and punishing wrongdoers.

"We, Mr. Speaker, are the government that put the Gomery Commission in place in order to find the answers that Canadians want to hear," said Martin.

Bloc Quebecois Leader Gilles Duceppe kept up with his theme of having the Liberals put an estimated $2.2 million in "dirty money" they allegedly got from the advertising firm Groupaction in trust.

"The Liberal Party said from the outset we will reimburse any money received inappropriately," Martin said.

"We'd like to not take any chances: They've been using dirty money for three elections; we don't want them to do it four times," Duceppe said.

http://sympaticomsn.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/1113219907936_21?hub=topstories

--
Take thy beak from out my heart, and take thy form from off my door!
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Tuesday, April 12, 2005 10:46:00 AM
 
какой у нас прекрасный Мэр

April 12, 2005

Miller bashed taxpayers

By Sue-Ann Levy -- For the Toronto Sun

I wanted to gag yesterday when I heard all the kudos our smug socialist mayor was getting for heading off a TTC strike mere hours before the deadline.

Chairman Howard Moscoe said it was a phone call between Mayor David Miller and ATU 113 president Bob Kinnear late Sunday afternoon that saved the day. "The mayor's involvement was critical at the 11th hour ... we knew we were in meltdown," he said, adding it could have been "a lot, lot worse."

His loyal deputy mayor and TTC commissioner Sandra Bussin called the $166-million package and wage hikes averaging 3% for three years "definitely a fair settlement.


"We have a mayor who works well with the citizens -- he was very effective," she said. "When they (the union workers) are treated honestly and with respect, we come to conclusions that are positive for everyone."

C'mon. Just who do the mayor and his leftist lapdogs think they're fooling?

The TTC strike was never going to happen. There's a new era at City Hall, all right. It's called the pro-union era.

This is the mayor every city union (save the police association) worked overtime to put in office. This is a pro-transit mayor.

Unions know alternative

I'll bet even tough-talking CUPE 416 president Brian Cochrane doesn't want to risk making Miller look bad with a strike, especially 18 months before re-election time. The unions know the alternative -- a more cost-conscious mayor who brings the dreaded "c" word (contracting out) into play.

So Miller showed respect to his union buddies. I wish I could say he showed the same respect for taxpayers.

Despite every assurance he would not give away the candy store, he did just the opposite. His talk about keeping to the rate of inflation flew right out the window. StatsCan reported inflation at 2% in Canada in February and as low as 1.7% in Toronto last year.

During February's budget debates, the mayor was forced to scour the reserve funds and sell off hydro poles to balance the books. At the time, budget chief David Soknacki insisted a 2% wage hike was all the city could afford and anything higher for the TTC -- the first group of unionized workers up for negotiations -- would set a dangerous precedent for every single city union.

Soknacki said yesterday the affordability issue ran into several roadblocks, including the lack of political will from council to "countenance a strike" or consider competition through contracting out. (If the city is forced to pay the employee health tax, as was arbitrated, it will cost an extra $6 million just for the TTC alone.)

Coun. Doug Holyday has no doubt this will "set the tone" for the rest of the union negotiations, which include the city's inside and outside workers, firefighters, zoo and library workers and the police.

"We couldn't even afford to keep up with inflation -- but to exceed it and give them everything they wanted ... this is absurd," he says.

Soknacki, who said he feels like "a pork chop at a Jewish wedding" trying to keep the city's costs in line, said the TTC agreement is at least $10 million richer than the city hoped for. He concedes it will have "ramifications" across the board.

Money higher than budgeted will come out of the TTC's Ridership Growth Strategy and other new services council had wanted to provide, Socknacki noted.

As Holyday sees it, the union "played it all out for maximum media exposure.

"These people are union diehards," he said. "I hope taxpayers recognize it because it's their money."


--
Too many clicks spoil the browse.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Tuesday, April 12, 2005 1:10:00 PM
 
ага, не говори
вчера был у окулиста, прикололся когда поговорили о том что за всё надо самому башлять, йееееей, воут макгинти!

Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Tuesday, April 12, 2005 3:39:00 PM
 
леопольд, какое НДП, забудь.
или Либералы или Консерваторы.
всё зависит от Онтарио.
Макгинти рвёцца к Харперу.
Joined: 10/19/2003
Posts: 16244
Posted on Tuesday, April 12, 2005 11:38:00 PM
 
Thor

Что значит: "рвется"? А Тори куда смотрит?
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Tuesday, April 12, 2005 11:42:00 PM
 
Тори провинциальный.. как и Макгилти

--
Too many clicks spoil the browse.
Joined: 3/25/2002
Posts: 2486
Posted on Wednesday, April 13, 2005 10:59:00 AM
 
The Conservative party will have to form a minority government. People in this country are too freaking stupid to give the landslide to the Torries. Damn monkies.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, April 13, 2005 11:07:00 AM
 
PoS: Jays won 4 in a row

--
Too many clicks spoil the browse.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, April 13, 2005 2:57:00 PM
 
thing right now is that it ain't how much the electorate likes the Conservatives it's how much the electorate is pissed off with the Liberals.

minority government is an option, but how much different would that be ?

also spoke to a person who was involved in the Reform party out West and she labels Harper as an opportunist.
Joined: 3/25/2002
Posts: 2486
Posted on Wednesday, April 13, 2005 3:47:00 PM
 
You got a big point there, bro. I am delighted about the Liberals going down to the sewer (that's where they belong to begin with). The problem is that the Conservatives can never articulate their points and present them without the stupid liberal media intermingling. Can they hold a minority government, NO. The bloc is a joke; they will bolt at the first opportunity. Damn, where is Ronnie where you need him.
Bring on the Gipper.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, April 13, 2005 4:09:00 PM
 
lets vote NDP, let them ruin the contry then rebuild

--
Too many clicks spoil the browse.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Wednesday, April 13, 2005 11:22:00 PM
 
As rumours of a spring election persist, at least one Liberal has called it quits on his party.

Edmonton MP David Kilgour made his intentions to sit as an Independent known late Tuesday. He was one of only two Liberals from Alberta, joining the party after being a Conservative until 1990. He sat in cabinet under Jean Chretien but was dropped when Paul Martin took over as Prime Minister.

http://www.pulse24.com/News/Top_Story/20050413-008/page.asp

--
Too many clicks spoil the browse.
Joined: 12/26/2004
Posts: 3893
Posted on Wednesday, April 13, 2005 11:34:00 PM
 
Народ!
Объясните же наконец популярно, в чем именно вы видите преимущество консерваторов перед либералами?
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, April 14, 2005 9:43:00 AM
 
looks like we gonna have elections in june, eh?

--
Too many clicks spoil the browse.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, April 14, 2005 11:27:00 AM
 
крысы начали сваливать .. О`Брайен послал либералов нах..

--
Too many clicks spoil the browse.
Joined: 3/25/2002
Posts: 2486
Posted on Thursday, April 14, 2005 11:39:00 AM
 
Let's the end begin. The Liberal descent into the depth of hell has begun.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, April 14, 2005 11:50:00 AM
 
I still think that Harper has to be more visible and more proactive in the media.. ppl have a hard time understanding who he is.

--
Too many clicks spoil the browse.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Thursday, April 14, 2005 11:50:00 AM
 
дык уже некоторые открыто пересекают "ковёр" парламента - are crossing the floor. goddamn politicians care for nothing but their careers.
in days of diefenbaker's fall it was cabinet ministers crossing over to the opposition, we'll keep an eye on these developments
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Thursday, April 14, 2005 11:52:00 AM
 
Harper is just odd...
He might be a a plain careerist.
Get rid off Stronach and McKay!!!

p.s. baseball doesn't have much to do with politics, but I don't delete it.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, April 14, 2005 11:54:00 AM
 
yes it does.. b/c we gonna go to a game to celebrate the merciless victory over the Fibs

--
Too many clicks spoil the browse.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Thursday, April 14, 2005 12:21:00 PM
 
no it is not
and if u r gonna act like, the ones we mentioned, i'ma gonna change me mind ;)
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Thursday, April 14, 2005 5:20:00 PM
 
To lunch or not to lunch?

The Prime Minister was grilled anew Thursday over suggestions he dined with Claude Boulay, a key player in the sponsorship scandal.

Paul Martin initially told reporters he never had lunch with the head of Liberal-friendly ad firm Groupe Everest ... to discuss contracts. When pressed, he then said they never dined after he formed government. Finally, he said he couldn’t recall ever having had lunch with the executive.

http://www.pulse24.com/News/Top_Story/20050414-012/page.asp

--
Too many clicks spoil the browse.
Joined: 12/21/2001
Posts: 30002
Posted on Thursday, April 14, 2005 5:21:00 PM
 

Долой социалистов!!!

Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Tuesday, November 8, 2005 6:27:00 PM
 
Ok, so the elections are in December yey!!

Tories won't be NDP's 'bargaining chip': Harper
CTV.ca News Staff

http://sympaticomsn.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20051108/martin_layton_051108#

Stephen Harper said he has no intention to put forward a no-confidence motion that could topple the minority Liberal government.

Such a move, said the Conservative Party leader, would just play into the hands of Jack Layton's NDP.

In a speech to the Canadian and Empire Clubs of Toronto on Tuesday, Harper said he was worried that Layton would use a Conservative non-confidence motion as leverage to gain more concessions from the Liberals -- something the NDP has done in the past.

"I have no intention of allowing a Conservative motion to be a bargaining chip in a parliamentary poker game," said Harper from the exact stage where Layton declared Monday that he will no longer prop up the Liberal minority government.

But in a following move, Harper reiterated that if Layton is serious about bringing down the Liberals, he can count on Conservative support.

"If Mr. Layton wants now or at any time to bring down the Liberal party and to bring it down clearly over their corruption … If he wants to do that and initiate measures, I can assure you he will have our support and our co-operation with that effort."

Video:
http://www.startcast.com/shows/10/A0164/code/M/content_inner/fs_video/video_display.asp?id=20051108&item=6&format=asf&baud=high



--
I am losing my insanity...
Joined: 10/1/2003
Posts: 6154
Posted on Tuesday, November 8, 2005 7:23:00 PM
 

На самом деле Тори действительно не очень хотят выборов в этом году. Я говорил с одним их человеком по этому поводу накануне репорта Гомери и мне показалось они не очень были настроены на выборы. Развитие событий конечно предсказать нельзя, но если будут то это будет сюрприз.
Joined: 3/17/2003
Posts: 16925
Posted on Tuesday, November 8, 2005 7:31:00 PM
 
Тори не готовы - нету хорошего лидера..

даже если Тори возьмут маджорити, хер знает что он там натворит, и какой из него лидер.. но все равно лучше чем Либералы или НДП

--
I am losing my insanity...
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Tuesday, January 24, 2006 1:08:45 AM
 
well done so far, now re-group and do better!!!

ELECTED SENATE
NOMINATED AND CONFIRMED SUPREME COURT
Joined: 3/25/2002
Posts: 2486
Posted on Tuesday, January 24, 2006 8:57:19 AM
 
The tories will have to run the country on the centrist platform. Maybe it's a better thing for the time being. People get used to to the conservative government.
Joined: 9/23/2005
Posts: 3448
Posted on Tuesday, January 24, 2006 10:56:31 AM
 
Totally agree with you. Moreover, that what I wanted Harper to do in the future is to be socially liberal, but fiscally conservative. Only following this formula his party will have longivity in Parlament. Otherwise, back to corruption and increased spending on social support.

Cheers!
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Tuesday, January 24, 2006 11:18:47 AM
 
как консервы могут быть fiscally conservative, если они нуждаются в поддержке НДП? Дело в том, что либералы не имеют никакого интереса к тому, чтобы у консервов что-то получалось. Равно как и блок (для которого консервы неожиданно стали конкурентами). Так что единственный союзник у консервов - это НДП. Ну и какая политика при этом получится?
Joined: 10/19/2003
Posts: 16244
Posted on Tuesday, January 24, 2006 12:40:47 PM
 
Бен

Тут уже много всяких слушков на форуме, почему Лейтон пошел на выборы. Так что, новые ему не нужны как можно дольше, стало быть....

В конце концов, ничего с ним не случится, если консервы проведут пяток каких-то законопректов, с которыми он вообще-то не согласен.

НДП, как мы уяснили, выбирают не за то, что они делают, а за то, что они говорят, чтобы они сделали, если бы...

Поэтому, если у либералов не прорежется новый приличный лидер, то Лейтон будет послушным, как никогда.
Joined: 8/31/2005
Posts: 4826
Posted on Tuesday, January 24, 2006 1:19:50 PM
 
Блиберы будут помогать Консерваторам в течении следующих 12-18 месяцев. Без Мартина они в жопе на некоторое время. Никто не хочет выборов через год, особенно блиберы, так как нет у них лидера.

НДП бесполезно будет в эти 2 года, ничего не добьются.
Блок бесполезен будет.

Консерваторы и блиберосы будут политикой заниматься.
Joined: 9/23/2005
Posts: 3448
Posted on Tuesday, January 24, 2006 1:33:10 PM
 
Leopold,

It's not a rumor but a fact, what Olivia Chow wants Jack Layton jumps to do it. Have you heard a candidate loosing an election then run again next time against incumbent? She run three times. She never gives up. Finally she is "satisfied", (I hope, if you know what I mean). Everybody happy.

Anyway, Conservatives don't need NDP to hold on to power because NDP has only 29 seats and that's not enough to give Conservatives majority vote in Parlament. So only chance Harper has if goes to bed with the Bloc.

Bloc is " fiscally conservative", they just want to separate from the rest of us, like Soviet republics from Russia. Bloc's problem that they have so many immigrants who don't know French and therefore don't want independant Quebec.
Joined: 8/31/2005
Posts: 4826
Posted on Tuesday, January 24, 2006 1:38:22 PM
 
«So only chance Harper has if goes to bed with the Bloc. »
Если бы да кабы во рту выросли грибы. Блок с консерваторами после этих выборов? Дюсеп спит и видит как Харпер ему воздух в Квебеке перекрывает. Ни в жисть.

Консерваторы и блибермоты. Это будет alliance.
Joined: 10/19/2003
Posts: 16244
Posted on Tuesday, January 24, 2006 2:00:22 PM
 
00х01

Правительство национального единства?

Такое только в войну бывает.

Хотя нет, в Германии была "большая коалиция", но там - пропорциональная система и коалиционное правительство существовало практически до последнего времени.

Odessa2

Я, честно говоря, не понимаю, почему нельзя дать Квебеку кое-какие вещи, например, отдельную сборную по хоккею, как они хотят. Есть прецеденты в футболе - почему нет? Если хоккеисты согласятся (а начинать,есс-но, придется с группы "С"), то пусть играют отдельно. На чемпионатах мира, хотя бы, потому что МОК их вряд ли признает пока.
Да там много чего им можно уступить без видимого вреда для федерации.
Но тогда можно будет и поторговаться.
Last edited by leopold on Tuesday, January 24, 2006 2:07:00 PM
 
Joined: 9/23/2005
Posts: 3448
Posted on Tuesday, January 24, 2006 3:14:18 PM
 
I have nothing against separate team for Quebec. In my personal opinion(IMPO) there more pluses than minuses for both teams. At the same time, majority of Canadians will be agaist the idea with a million of stupid excusses and their tunnel vision.

At least we have minority goverment for the first time in 14 years. Hope they will have enough courage to scrap "Gun registry" bullshit.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Tuesday, January 24, 2006 3:16:06 PM
 
it's more about unity than sovereignty.
though it makes sense. scotland and wales got their own soccer teams.
but who's gonna pay for qc hockey team ? a good old canadian taxpayer.
Joined: 10/19/2003
Posts: 16244
Posted on Tuesday, January 24, 2006 3:21:52 PM
 
Тор

А что такого? Есть же фонд поддержки федерации, денежки из которого утекли херкуда. Пусть из него и финансируют сборные Квебека по всем возможным и невозможным видам спорта, не жалко.
Joined: 10/1/2003
Posts: 6154
Posted on Tuesday, January 24, 2006 3:26:53 PM
 
«At least we have minority goverment for the first time in 14 years. Hope they will have enough courage to scrap "Gun registry" bullshit.»

я думаю харпер умней чем открывать это дело заново. готов спорить он не будет этот вопрос трогать.
Last edited by marx on Tuesday, January 24, 2006 3:33:00 PM
 
Joined: 10/19/2003
Posts: 16244
Posted on Tuesday, January 24, 2006 3:33:07 PM
 
Закрывать уже работающее на самом деле нет смысла.
А вот показать, что правительство как минимум догадывается, что стреляют как раз из оружиякотороеникогданебудетзарегистрировано - очень даже надо.
Joined: 10/10/2001
Posts: 9593
Posted on Tuesday, January 24, 2006 3:37:28 PM
 
как сказал лидер Зеленых, закон о регистрации оружия означает что то незаконное оружие которое используется на улицах малолетками сейчас стало ещё более незаконным (now is REALLY illegal)
-----
Don't drive faster than your angel can fly
Joined: 10/19/2003
Posts: 16244
Posted on Tuesday, January 24, 2006 3:43:58 PM
 
ВОт консерваторы и должны принять закон, вдвойне ужесточающий наказание за его использование.
Joined: 7/10/2005
Posts: 5659
Posted on Tuesday, January 24, 2006 4:30:41 PM
 
«
At least we have minority goverment for the first time in 14 years. Hope they will have enough courage to scrap "Gun registry" bullshit.»


Я тоже надеюсь... 2 миллиарда баксов коту под хвост, лучше ментам бы по ушам надавали чтоб не только засады с радарами на дорогах делали, а бандитов ловили. Пистолеты например зарегистриваны с 1937 года, ну что? Толку ноль - сами менты сказали. Кстати Джулиано Фантино сказал, что Торонтовской полиции денег колосально не хватает, а финансы идут на Регистрирование, которое полиции помагает как метрвому припарка. Из всех пистолетов что были добыты полицией в прошлом году, было не одного! хоть когда либо зарегистрировано. Бандиты же не полные идиоты, они и в Штатах пользуются нелегальным оружием, а не в Валмарте его покупают.

Что такое регистрация - это запись в компютере что человек А что живет по аддресу Б владеет сволом Ц с Номером 222333222. Эта запись - головная боль и полиции и владельцев так как за 2 года компы были взломаны 221 раз -> кто угодно мог получить инфо где лежат стволы. Бандит же если спиздил ствол, ликвидирует серийный номер за 2 минуты напилником, или 30 секунд если исползует дрель с насадкой... После чего происхождение ствола будет из мира гипотиз...

Если посмотреть статистику 1995 года, то у людей было около 20 миллиона стволов, сейчас по Либеральной статистике, только 7. 13 медленно легализуются либо попали в нелегальный оборот, от чего мне легче спать не становится.

Кстати, после регистрации Январь 2003 рост приступности стал расти из года в год (до нее падал, за исключения 1995 когда пару анти оружейных законов было принято), я думаю вы как народ умный и так как газеты читаете, это заметили. Да и помощи никому (ни полиции ни гражданам) она не оказала (только налоги жрет, можно было бы ГСТ на бензин совсем отменить, только на одном етом).

Законы что якобы контролируют оружие, котролируют оружие тех, кто изначально придерживается законов и не делают ничего плохого. Те кто плевал же на законы, наплюет и на контрольные типа регистрации.

Запрет на пистолеты - вообще идиотизм за наши же деньги - конфисковать по закону нельзя, но можно выкупить. Итого 1 миллион пистолетов, скажем по $500 (песимистическая цена)... весим в трубе и дефиците. А толку то? С нашими дырявыми границами... Даже Австралия и Британия (окруженные водой прошу заметить, а не самой длинной границей со Штатами где тысячи сельских дорог даже не охраняются) немогут справится с наплывом нелегальных стволов...
Joined: 7/10/2005
Posts: 5659
Posted on Tuesday, January 24, 2006 4:51:32 PM
 
Главный толк от Консерваторов (может они такие же засранцы как и все) это то что может воровать не будут открытую как Либералы (эти совсем оборзели), понизят налоги (хотя бы ГСТ - что в принципе им придется, иначе перевыборы продуют) и дадут деньги (наличкой) людям с детьми (а не обещание потратить деньги неизветно куда, но якобы на детские садики как Либералы). А НДП - хочет налоги повысить и тратить на право и на лево, причем как всегда бюрократы раскрадут все до того как до нас хоть что-то дойдет (Онтарио это уже проходило, кстати Онтарийских долг при НДП в первый раз и появился). Все остальные типа Зеленых, даже платформу предвыборную не успели написать как выборы закончились. Зато удивило что 4 тысячи обкуреных смогли поднять жопу с бадуна и проголосовать за партию марихуанны...

Лучше "tax cut" в крамане с наличкой, чем корупция и обещания в воздухе. МакГинти уже "3 короба наобещал", после чего влепил Хелс Премию от $300 до $900 нам свами (через 2 месяца платить ее кстати), а госпитоля так и остались у разбитого корыта. Что касается "дефицита" от Консерваторов, то все книги бух.учета свободно лежат на www.gov.on.ca и там видно, что Консерваторы вывели Онтарио из дефицита и был сюрплюс пока SARS с Black Out-ом не пришел, да Либералы с выборами (теперь постоянный дефицит). В Алберте кстати Концерваторы правят уже давно и в итоге - у провинции нет долгов, нет PST, деньги дают на Рождество ($400 на человека в этом году) и т.д. Кстати, гляньте кого они выбрали в етот раз... все 28 мест у Консерваторов с отрывом в 80% от всех...
Joined: 3/25/2002
Posts: 2486
Posted on Tuesday, January 24, 2006 4:58:51 PM
 
Bin Vladen,
Good stuff. Preach it, brother. Away with the Liberal junta.
Joined: 11/11/2005
Posts: 36921
Posted on Tuesday, January 24, 2006 5:05:18 PM
 
« Зато удивило что 4 тысячи обкуреных смогли поднять жопу с бадуна и проголосовать за партию марихуанны...

»


из всего предложенного - самый пральный вариант кста

Жалко у меня нет привычки сё-таки за балласт голосовать
-----
проще я не стану, даже если люди перестанут ко мне тянуться
Joined: 7/10/2005
Posts: 5659
Posted on Tuesday, January 24, 2006 9:54:11 PM
 
«В америке кстати сняли бан на ассолт вепонс недавно... так.. для справки... »

Это правда, запрет на Assault Weapons и магазины на больше чем 10 патронов тоже разрешили и что? Криминал как падал, так и падает. Негры как стреляли друг друга с пистолет пулеметов, так и стреляют. Никто не побежал пулеметы покупать или на улицах стрелять... Короче, закон умер (запрет делали на 10 лет) и никто не заметил, правда перед этим придурки все кречали что США на пороге гражданки, ужас будет и все такое... потом их с экранов убрали и забыли...

В Бразили сделали в етом году референдум чтоб запретить оружие с подачи всяких активистов и проиграли 40% к 60%, так что оружие не такой и простой вопрос...

Забавный факт - уровень изнасилований на долю населения (на 100,000) в США меньше в 10 раз меньше чем в Канаде, так как идиот может легко нарватся на целый список неприятностей из дамской сумочки включая предметы которые могут яйца отстрелить... А в Канаде женщинам даже болончик с газом носить нельзя - уголовная статья и все такое... Вот придурки и насилуют даже средь бела дня - каждую неделю какая-то сводка просабачивается, особенно про школьниц что на автобусах ездят....
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Tuesday, January 24, 2006 10:36:33 PM
 
Мне только интересно, откуда некие товарищи могут знать, какой процент изнасилований в Канаде, если в Канадском праве нет понятия изнасилование? Статистику такого рода можно собирать только на основании данных правоохранительных органов, которые руководствуются Уголовным Кодексом, в котором, как я сказал, понятия "изнасилование" нет. У нас есть понятие sexual assault, которое включает все, включая прикосновение к груди женщины. Если сравнивать это с правом некоторых американских штатов, где есть понятие "изнасилование", то конечно "прикосновений к груди" будет в сотни раз больше чем изнасилований.
Joined: 6/12/2003
Posts: 11311
Posted on Tuesday, January 24, 2006 10:54:03 PM
 
Ну что, уже известно, кто на выборах победил?
-----
Ябычаю...
Joined: 8/31/2005
Posts: 4826
Posted on Wednesday, January 25, 2006 12:48:59 AM
 
«Ну что, уже известно, кто на выборах победил?»

Известно что города в этих выборах проиграли - в 3х самых больших городах ни одного консерватива не выбрали. Как же они будут в правительстве в следующие пол-года свои права отстаивать? Дебилы.
Joined: 6/12/2003
Posts: 11311
Posted on Wednesday, January 25, 2006 2:33:37 AM
 
Так кто?!
-----
Ябычаю...
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, January 25, 2006 3:55:34 AM
 
0х, не гони. никто не будет щемить то, вэн и монреаль.
либералы будут сидеть и отстаивать также как и ндп.

фр,
консерваторы в правительстве. minority.

п.с. звонки принято возвращать
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, January 25, 2006 3:56:15 AM
 
«Тор

А что такого? Есть же фонд поддержки федерации, денежки из которого утекли херкуда. Пусть из него и финансируют сборные Квебека по всем возможным и невозможным видам спорта, не жалко.»


лео, забываешь, денежки оттуда уплывают не атлетам, а либералам и их прихвостням. slush funds
Joined: 8/31/2005
Posts: 4826
Posted on Wednesday, January 25, 2006 8:48:08 AM
 
«0х, не гони. никто не будет щемить то, вэн и монреаль.
либералы будут сидеть и отстаивать также как и ндп.
»


щемить? хехе, неее, щемить никто не будет. Но и из кожи вон лезть тоже не будут. Скажем так, Торонто, Монтреаль и Ванкувер не будут 'топ прайорити'.
Joined: 9/23/2005
Posts: 3448
Posted on Wednesday, January 25, 2006 9:07:11 AM
 
«Закрывать уже работающее на самом деле нет смысла.
А вот показать, что правительство как минимум догадывается, что стреляют как раз из оружиякотороеникогданебудетзарегистрировано - очень даже надо.»


Leopold,

I hate to destroy something that is working. In my personal opinion this gun registry doesn't work.

They already proved to all that unregistered guns is used on the streets for $2B as Bin indicated. Do you want additional prove? Like you didn't knew it beforehand? I might be missing something, please explain.

Thanks.

By the way... I agree with Bin's position on the role of govement. He has future in politics.
Joined: 7/10/2005
Posts: 5659
Posted on Wednesday, January 25, 2006 11:41:19 AM
 
«Мне только интересно, откуда некие товарищи могут знать, какой процент изнасилований в Канаде, если в Канадском праве нет понятия изнасилование? »

Шутник однако... Есть offence "sexual assault" которое может быть violent & non-violent. Если нужно, можешь запросить информацию от полиции какой процент чего был и колько из етих sexual assault были actual rapes. Если тебя под дулом пистолета заставят миньет делать, я думаю тебе легче не будет если это "rape" не назавут... тоже есть такой момент. Кстати есть куча женских организаций что эту статистику запрашивали и анализировали, так что идея того что если в законе нет специфического определения, то государственная информация информация не существует просто глупа.
Last edited by BinVladen on Wednesday, January 25, 2006 11:45:00 PM
 
Joined: 7/10/2005
Posts: 5659
Posted on Wednesday, January 25, 2006 11:44:22 PM
 
«У нас есть понятие sexual assault, которое включает все, включая прикосновение к груди женщины. Если сравнивать это с правом некоторых американских штатов, где есть понятие "изнасилование", то конечно "прикосновений к груди" будет в сотни раз больше чем изнасилований.»

Что в Америке, что в Канаде, есть понятие violent sexual assault и non-violent sexual assault . В любом случае, факт тот что уровень violent sexual assault в Канаде в 10 раз больше чем в Штатах, и я не думаю что тут кому-то легче станет от того что это не наживается "rape" в статистике. А "прикосновениe к груди" violent saxual assault не назовут...
Joined: 11/15/2005
Posts: 6300
Posted on Wednesday, January 25, 2006 11:53:25 PM
 
BinVladen
Joined: 7/10/2005
Posts: 83 Posted on Wednesday, January 25, 2006 11:44:22 PM Что в Америке, что в Канаде, есть понятие violent sexual assault и non-violent sexual assault . [Quote]


бред сивой кобылы
non-violent sexual assault is maybe a harrassing phone call
touching breast is violent, but not rape


бен прав 100%
хорошая память кстати, молодец
Joined: 6/12/2003
Posts: 11311
Posted on Thursday, January 26, 2006 12:52:13 AM
 
«п.с. звонки принято возвращать»

Какие звонки? Когда звонил?
-----
Ябычаю...
Last edited by Fille Rulle on Thursday, January 26, 2006 12:53:00 AM
 
Joined: 10/19/2003
Posts: 16244
Posted on Thursday, January 26, 2006 12:58:06 AM
 
Да уж консерваторам есть чем заняться:

Вот, получил сегодня анкету заполнить, а там вопросец:

Gender: Female () Male ()

Do you consider yourself to be a member of a designated group;

Aboriginal
Visible Minority
Persons with disabilities
Women

Ну, ладно, то, что "майноритиз" был я и девушка из Словакии (из 20 человек) - это отдельная тема,хотя уже пора для отдельно взятых населенных пунктов это понятие пересматривать.

Но вот довести страну до того, чтобы в правительственных анкетах Female могла не относиться к Women , или,наоборот,Male мог относить себя к Women - Это уже полный пипец.

КТо же это придумал? Наверное, марсиане.
Joined: 10/1/2003
Posts: 6154
Posted on Thursday, January 26, 2006 10:52:20 PM
 
leopold 100% бред. :)

кстати интересная новость для тех кто кричал что консервативное правительство будет на поводке у США.


=====
Сегодня в Оттаве вновь избранный премьер-министр Канады Стивен Харпер дал свою первую после объявления результатов выборов пресс-конференцию. Отвечая на вопросы журналистов, Харпер, в частности раскритиковал посла Соединенных Штатов Америки Дэвида Уилкинса, которому не понравилась идея нового премьера о размещении в арктических водах нескольких кораблей и ледоколов из состава ВМС Канады. "Не стоит создавать проблему там, где ее не существует", - заявил вчера Уилкинс, выступая перед студентами Университета Западного Онтарио в Лондоне. -"Мы не признаём канадских претензий на эти акватории, да и многие другие страны - тоже". "Соединенные Штаты защищают свой суверенитет", - сказал сегодня Харпер, - "а канадское правительство защищает свой. Мы имеем мандат от народа Канады а не от полномочного посла США". В предвыборных обещаниях нового руководителя государства говорилось о том, что в ближайшие 5 лет на защиту арктических вод от России США и Дании будет израсходовано 5 млрд. 300 млн. долларов.
=====
Joined: 5/10/2004
Posts: 108
Posted on Friday, January 27, 2006 12:28:46 AM
 
главное чтобы не втянули канаду в америкоские войны и семитские междоусобицы.
Joined: 11/15/2005
Posts: 6300
Posted on Friday, January 27, 2006 12:32:48 AM
 
главное чтобы костюмчик сидел
Joined: 10/19/2003
Posts: 16244
Posted on Friday, January 27, 2006 12:33:52 AM
 
Маркс

Когда вся эта буза случилась с Данией, Харпер очень резко высказывался касательно "патриотизма" либералов. Теперь у него есть возможность ликвидировать национальный позор, когда у страны, которая выходит на 3 океана, не было ни одного военного корабля ледового класса.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, November 5, 2008 10:28:08 AM
 
http://www.boston.com/bostonglobe/editorial_opinion/oped/articles/2008/11/05/on_right_reasons_for_some_solace


TO BE a conservative in Massachusetts is to know disappointment, never more so than on Election Day, when candidates and causes of the right rarely stand a chance. Waiting in line at my Brookline polling place yesterday, I was under no illusion that my vote would change the outcome: Barney Frank would be reelected to the US House, John Kerry would go back to the Senate, and Massachusetts would vote decisively for Barack Obama.

But even for a red voter in the bluest of states, Election 2008 has its consolations:

The Clintons really won't be going back to the White House.

We haven't seen the last of Sarah Palin, who demonstrated star power as she withstood with aplomb and good humor a vicious assault from the left.

Government financing of political campaigns, always a dreadful idea, is dead. Yes, Obama egregiously broke his solemn promise to accept public financing and its attendant spending limits. But having witnessed Obama's astonishing financial blowout - he raised well over $600 million - no future candidate will agree to be shackled by those limits.

A turn in the wilderness will do Republicans good. During the GOP's years in power, the onetime party of fiscal sobriety and limited government turned into a gang of reckless spenders and government aggrandizers. Perhaps a few years in exile will lead Republicans back to their conservative, Reaganite roots.

But the most lustrous silver lining of all is the racial one. As a politician and policymaker, Obama distresses me; his extreme liberalism is not what the nation needs. But as a symbol - a son of Africa elected to lead a majority-white nation that once enslaved Africans and treated their descendants with great cruelty - Obama's rise makes me proud of my country. The anthem of the Civil Rights Movement was "We Shall Overcome." Impossible as it might have seemed scant decades ago, we have.
Joined: 3/9/2002
Posts: 4368
Posted on Wednesday, November 5, 2008 11:15:46 AM
 
Тор, проблема в том, что основные принципы, на которых базировалась рейганомика, мертвы. Они больше не работают. Поэтому никакого возвращения к ним быть не может. Американские инвесторы добились своего и полностью добили производительные силы внутри своей страны. Сначала исчезла проиводственная база, потом услуги стали предоставляться извне, при этом рост американской экономики финансировался иностранцами через покупку американских долговых облигаций. И все это было сделано для того, чтобы поддерживать для американских толстосумов profit margins. Сейчас мы видим, что инвесторы извне Америки будут играть всю большую роль на фондовом рынке.

Кроме того, нынешние выборы подтвержают, что произошла смена поколений, при которой молодые стали активнее участвовать в общественной жизни. Для них раса, сексуальная ориентация, пол и прочие химеры не имеют никакого значения. Консерватизм в рейгановском понимании тоже доживает последние дни.
Joined: 3/14/2003
Posts: 9593
Posted on Wednesday, November 5, 2008 11:19:36 AM
 
кстате бен мает рацию ггыг.
внатуре в некатарых вешйах свабодный рынок и прочие кансерваторские фишки даходят до реального падсырания прастово насиления.
да, заебок,какая нить кантора падняла профит с икс до 2*икс за счет аутсорсинга.
а то шо при этом местному насилению нечем за мотргидж платить - ниибет.
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, November 5, 2008 11:29:24 AM
 
«Тор, проблема в том, что основные принципы, на которых базировалась рейганомика, мертвы. Они больше не работают. Поэтому никакого возвращения к ним быть не может. Американские инвесторы добились своего и полностью добили производительные силы внутри своей страны. Сначала исчезла проиводственная база, потом услуги стали предоставляться извне, при этом рост американской экономики финансировался иностранцами через покупку американских долговых облигаций. И все это было сделано для того, чтобы поддерживать для американских толстосумов profit margins. Сейчас мы видим, что инвесторы извне Америки будут играть всю большую роль на фондовом рынке.

Кроме того, нынешние выборы подтвержают, что произошла смена поколений, при которой молодые стали активнее участвовать в общественной жизни. Для них раса, сексуальная ориентация, пол и прочие химеры не имеют никакого значения. Консерватизм в рейгановском понимании тоже доживает последние дни.»


согласен. рейган нужен был для победы над горби. рейганомикз - прошлое.
какой turn-out был? высокий. что-то наподобие 60ых (кеннеди, хиппиз, цитирую fear and loathing in las vegas: EXT. 1965 STOCK FOOTAGE We are in SAN FRANCISCO. IMAGES OF THE TIME FLOOD IN.

DUKE (V/O)
THERE WAS MADNESS IN ANY DIRECTION,
AT ANY HOUR... YOU COULD STRIKE
SPARKS ANYWHERE. THERE WAS A
FANTASTIC UNIVERSAL SENSE THAT
WHATEVER WE WERE DOING WAS RIGHT,
THAT WE WERE WINNING. AND THAT, I
THINK, WAS THE HANDLE -- THAT SENSE
OF INEVITABLE VICTORY OVER THE
FORCES OF OLD AND EVIL. NOT IN ANY
MEAN OR MILITARY SENSE; WE DIDN'T
NEED THAT. OUR ENERGY WOULD SIMPLY
prevail. We had all the momentum;
we were riding the crest of a high
and beautiful wave...")

молодёжь за обаму. а в Канаде база, на которой основаны либералы, дала трещину. т.е. ликвидируецца извне. но консы у власти. твой анализ, свп
Joined: 3/1/2002
Posts: 51165
Posted on Wednesday, November 5, 2008 1:01:47 PM
 
«кстате бен мает рацию ггыг.
внатуре в некатарых вешйах свабодный рынок и прочие кансерваторские фишки даходят до реального падсырания прастово насиления.
да, заебок,какая нить кантора падняла профит с икс до 2*икс за счет аутсорсинга.
а то шо при этом местному насилению нечем за мотргидж платить - ниибет.»


дык money is the 'nu' race. not really new in fact, but in layman's terms.
бен точно про профит маржинз сказал.

бен, производственная база адаптируецца к правилам рынка: mergers of big automakers, теперь японки в штатах собирают (мексика и пр.).

a произ. база всяко видоизменяецца под давлением изменений рынков, раб. силы, трудоустройства и девальвации доллара
а Китай всё равно весь мир одевает
Last edited by Thor on Wednesday, November 5, 2008 1:03:00 PM
 
Page: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 [All]
Forums » Archive » Conservative Review  
Copyright © 2020 Torontovka.com, All rights reserved